Would you pick a yellow-carded team for playoffs?

[Psychoflood]

I would have to say it depends heavilly on how they got the yellow card. If it was a mistake or something that wasn't completely intentional, i would have no problem picking the team. However, if the team had been harassing other robots and finally got the yellow card they deserve, even if that robot has what our alliance needs to win if the possibility of them getting easilly red-carded remains, i'd rather be safe than sorry.

[Cory]

Originally Posted by Psychoflood

I would have to say it depends heavilly on how they got the yellow card. If it was a mistake or something that wasn't completely intentional

It's going to be hard to get a yellow card on accident, in my opinion. If you get it, you're going to deserve it, and it may be a sign of teams that are continually too aggressive, rather than just doing something wrong in one match.

[Zoheb N]

i would pick up a yellow-carded team because I according to the rules the status of the card is reset

[Kim Masi]

I think if a team has a yellow card, that shows their aggressiveness in playing the game. Others may disagree, but I think that is another criteria to consider when picking teams.

Getting a yellow card to me shows that a team is willing to push their limits and test just how far they can go.

I'm not saying that I'm in favor of teams being aggressive or anything of that sort, and I think that if a team got a red card, then it would be a completely different story.

[Lil' Lavery]

1625 got a yellow card at IRI 2006 (IRI has used them at least since 2004, when I first attended) during the qualification matches. 71 picked them to join their 5th seeded alliance. That alliance went on to win IRI.
Also, I believe that yellow cards carried over between qualification and elimination matches at IRI, and they don't during official FIRST events, which would make a yellow card team more appealing.
If a team has received one (or more) red cards, it may be a different situation.

[Dave Flowerday]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

1625 got a yellow card at IRI 2006 (IRI has used them at least since 2004, when I first attended) during the qualification matches. 71 picked them to join their 5th seeded alliance.

In the end it worked out for them, but I wonder if the real question is "Would they have been picked by a higher-seeded alliance otherwise?" Of course we can't know the answer to that.

[Ricky Q.]

In 2004, 71 seeded #1 at IRI and 980 seeded #2. 980 had a yellow card from qualifying, but was picked by #71. We joined the alliance as the 3rd team and ended up winning after some hard fought matches, including winning one where an opposing team who had a previous yellow card was called on it again and automatically DQ'd.

After IRI that year there was a discussion on here about the card system, and I wrote:

Originally Posted by Ricky Q.

Yellow cards made drivers and coaches more aware of their robot and their actions on the field. Duing one of our strategy planning talks before he finals Team 980's coach said, "Remember we have a yellow card, don't do anything stupid", to their drivers and they were careful not to bring out that Red card.

And John VN replied with a statement that I strongly agree with:

Originally Posted by JVN

I think this single statement, more than any other, proves that this system has it's desired effect.

-John

I think it wouldn't be so bad a thing if cards carried to eliminations. Food for thought.

[Nawaid Ladak]

here is my opinion on the card system

it's great for the qualifying matches. but PLEASE, don't use them for the Elimination rounds

thats the only thing i really don't like.

Whats more exciting than watching two robots going at it in a aggressive pushing match go get posission for a spoiler with 30 seconds left in the match. in finals 1:3 of the nationals where both teams get a red card.

This rule will really rui some teams that are known for playing aggressive,

thats besides the point, anyways, i would pick the yellow card team because i know that they are willing to push people around, and that they CAN do it if need be.

Offence brings the crowds, but defense wins championships

it seems that FIRST is nibbleing off the defense aspect of the games lately. (ie: no wedges last year, and a card system this year. im not saying FIRST is doing anything wrong, im just saying that the game might not be as exciting to watch as it used to be in the final matches.)

[ThomasP]

Originally Posted by FreedomForce

here is my opinion on the card system

it's great for the qualifying matches. but PLEASE, don't use them for the Elimination rounds

thats the only thing i really don't like.

Whats more exciting than watching two robots going at it in a aggressive pushing match go get posission for a spoiler with 30 seconds left in the match. in finals 1:3 of the nationals where both teams get a red card.

This rule will really rui some teams that are known for playing aggressive,

thats besides the point, anyways, i would pick the yellow card team because i know that they are willing to push people around, and that they CAN do it if need be.

Offence brings the crowds, but defense wins championships

it seems that FIRST is nibbleing off the defense aspect of the games lately. (ie: no wedges last year, and a card system this year. im not saying FIRST is doing anything wrong, im just saying that the game might not be as exciting to watch as it used to be in the final matches.)

There's a difference between being defensive and being overly aggressive, this isn't battlebots .

[Aren_Hill]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

1625 got a yellow card at IRI 2006 (IRI has used them at least since 2004, when I first attended) during the qualification matches. 71 picked them to join their 5th seeded alliance. That alliance went on to win IRI.
Also, I believe that yellow cards carried over between qualification and elimination matches at IRI, and they don't during official FIRST events, which would make a yellow card team more appealing.
If a team has received one (or more) red cards, it may be a different situation.

As a driver at IRI i don't recall having ever received a yellow card or physically having a drivetrain capable of being agressive enough(we had 2 cims at 8fps)
our robot couldn't push a kiwi drive let alone be agressively driven. plus our strategy was pure offense.

just a correction for the reputation of my team

aren

[Andy Grady]

I think that the card system does nothing more than give a visual indication of things already practiced. It will make the offending teams more paranoid yes, but I would guess that the yellow card system will be used about as much as warning a team of overagressiveness in the past.

In previous years, you would always be weary of teams who you knew were a danger to get DQed in a round. But one stray warning woudln't really make much of a difference.

In other words...a yellow card on a team wouldn't stop me from selecting them at all. If a team has been red carded...well, now we are talking about a possible problem.

I do applaud the yellow/red card system and FIRST's effort to clarify rules on hitting and wedge bots this year. Now maybe there will not be such a grey area.

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by Gear

As a driver at IRI i don't recall having ever received a yellow card or physically having a drivetrain capable of being agressive enough(we had 2 cims at 8fps)
our robot couldn't push a kiwi drive let alone be agressively driven. plus our strategy was pure offense.

just a correction for the reputation of my team

aren

The yellow card was given to both 1625 and 234 after a Qualifying match. 116 had lined up a defensive block against 234 and a pushing match began. 1625 came in behind 234, and added your pushing power to the fray (as you either couldn't, or didn't feel comfortable shooting over 234).
(116 is behind 910 in this picture)

This lasted for a few seconds, before 234 somehow managed to get underneath 116's wheels, and when driving forward, caused 116 to tip backwards.


While this call was certainly borderline (even I felt so, as 116's coach), especially for 1625, both 234 and 1625 did receive yellow cards.

[Aren_Hill]

if we received a yellow card shouldn't we be notified? in some way shape or form? plus as a driver this year i either planted our foot and sat there or ran away our strategy has never had pushing involved. plus the only reason we'd have been behind 234 is if there was balls to be collected or setting up to shoot

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by Gear

if we received a yellow card shouldn't we be notified? in some way shape or form? plus as a driver this year i either planted our foot and sat there or ran away our strategy has never had pushing involved. plus the only reason we'd have been behind 234 is if there was balls to be collected or setting up to shoot

It was announced over the PA after the match ended. You may have been setting up to shoot, and as you can see in the picture, you opened fire as we tipped. Perhaps until we tipped, you had been out of range? (after you joined, and until 116 tipped, the 3 robots basically didn't move at all, the pushing power was that close)

[Aren_Hill]

our shooting range was easily that distance and its a good bet we were setting up to shoot. which may have just been misunderstood as us pushing. which the only time we tried to push was when we were stuck in a corner (if you want an unsuccessful attempt example check this match we were in the corner the entire time (http://www.soap.circuitrunners.com/2006/movies/galileo/ match 17)
and if you notice were still in the same spot