What is Easy C good for?

[artdutra04]

It seem to be quite useless =S

I'm sorry, but I have to completely disagree with that statement. EasyC PRO, just like MPLAB, is just a tool that helps you write code. And from my experiences, EasyC PRO just makes that process a lot more efficient.

Every season prior to the current season, we programmed our robot in MPLAB. We usually had a robot that worked, and we usually had some sort of a simple dead reckoning autonomous mode. It worked, but it was clearly quite time consuming to develop amazing code in MPLAB.

This fall, as a beta tester for EasyC PRO, I decided to take out some of the many sensors that our team never used on our FRC robot, like gyros and accelerometers and start programming them in EasyC PRO. Literally within hours, I had PID Control for the gyro perfected. I know for a fact that if I tried that in MPLAB it would have taken much longer!

The amazing thing I love in EasyC is the speed at which you can get code done. Deep down inside I'm not an uber-programmer geek. I'm not one of those people who incessantly insists that they develop 100% of their code in a text editor in Linux. I honestly don't care how the code is developed, all I care about is the end result. And if I spend 1 hour in EasyC PRO and accomplish twice as much, then you better bet that's what I going to use to program the robot!

Even the main programming mentor on our team - a college student pursuing a degree in computer science - has realized how useful and amazing EasyC PRO is, especially their built in color-syntax text editor. I gave him the PID control code I developed in the fall and already we have the basis for an amazing closed-loop feedback and control system for our robot's tele-operated and autonomous modes, at a degree light years ahead of the sophistication we could have achieved in MPLAB.

So in the end it's up to your team to decide. But just like the Mac vs. PC vs. Linux debate, choose your opinion only after you've extensively used each product. For everyone that does not like EasyC, open your mind and take EasyC PRO for a test run for at least a few days.

[EHaskins]

I think its not good for use by experienced programmers. I actually hate using it I can write something in MPLab in less than 1/4 the time it takes in easyC, but I also like DOS.

EasyC is GREAT for rookies and people who don't know C. I have used it as a training aid because it still uses C syntax, but it is so simple.

EasyC has its uses, but I will never run it on our robot.

[JamesBrown]

Originally Posted by EHaskins

I think its not good for use by experienced programmers. I actually hate using it I can write something in MPLab in less than 1/4 the time it takes in easyC, but I also like DOS.

EasyC is GREAT for rookies and people who don't know C. I have used it as a training aid because it still uses C syntax, but it is so simple.

EasyC has its uses, but I will never run it on our robot.

Have you used Easy C Pro?

There is no way you can write something in MPLAB faster. I admit that I have made the same statement about never running easy c on my teams robot but I can no longer stand by that, If I was on another team where I was primarily doing programming, I would use EasyC Pro, just because I have too much to do in a day to spend an in necessary amount of time on coding for the team. It has nothing to do with my programming abilities, it has every thing to do with the fact that I value my time. I spend atleast a couple of hours a day writing code for schoo, research, robotics, and personal use. I saw limitations in original easy c but they are gone. Now if only Intellitek could write EasyC++, EasyJava, EasyPython, and EasyVisualC# I could cut my time spent writing code down significantly.

James

[intellec7]

There are certain things that, from what I have seen, can not be accomplished in EasyC, but again, these are things that an experienced programmer would feel the need to do.

Things like custom control of the 2nd serial port, I think you can't do. Also, the limit of only one gyro, and the limit of only the TRACK camera command.

When I code, I like to know exactly what is going on. The WPIlib source code is not available, so I don't know what is happening behind the scenes.

I think EasyC is a great tool for those not accustomed to syntax languages. It helps in visualizing what is happening in the code. It is very far from useless.

[JamesBrown]

Originally Posted by intellec7

There are certain things that, from what I have seen, can not be accomplished in EasyC, but again, these are things that an experienced programmer would feel the need to do.

Things like custom control of the 2nd serial port, I think you can't do. Also, the limit of only one gyro, and the limit of only the TRACK camera command.

When I code, I like to know exactly what is going on. The WPIlib source code is not available, so I don't know what is happening behind the scenes.

I think EasyC is a great tool for those not accustomed to syntax languages. It helps in visualizing what is happening in the code. It is very far from useless.

Easy C pro allows you to edit and write your own code in C. As I understand it, if you can do it in MPLAB then you can do it in EasyC PRO

[amateurrobotguy]

Originally Posted by JamesBrown

Have you used Easy C Pro?

There is no way you can write something in MPLAB faster. I admit that I have made the same statement about never running easy c on my teams robot but I can no longer stand by that, If I was on another team where I was primarily doing programming, I would use EasyC Pro, just because I have too much to do in a day to spend an in necessary amount of time on coding for the team. It has nothing to do with my programming abilities, it has every thing to do with the fact that I value my time. I spend atleast a couple of hours a day writing code for schoo, research, robotics, and personal use. I saw limitations in original easy c but they are gone. Now if only Intellitek could write EasyC++, EasyJava, EasyPython, and EasyVisualC# I could cut my time spent writing code down significantly.

James

And why don't you just pay someone to write all your code for you...it would be easier...I value my time as well, and it is better spent understanding why my code runs instead of your mentality of "I push this magic lever forward and it moves"

[Doug Leppard]

Originally Posted by EHaskins

I think its not good for use by experienced programmers. I actually hate using it I can write something in MPLab in less than 1/4 the time it takes in easyC, but I also like DOS.

EasyC is GREAT for rookies and people who don't know C. I have used it as a training aid because it still uses C syntax, but it is so simple.

EasyC has its uses, but I will never run it on our robot.

Last year we did everything in MPLab and had a killer autonomous mode. This year we have two professional programmers, one with Lockheed Martin and one with Electronic Arts.

This year we are using EasyC Pro. The programmers are amazed what they can do and it makes it easier for the kids to program too.

[Kingofl337]

We are getting ready to release an update to easyC PRO that allows you to select which gyro your are using 80, 150, or 300. Also allows for adjusting the dead band.

Also, you can send anything you want to the camera. If you look in API.h you will see WriteSerialPortTwo(unsigned char). You can send any message you want to the camera. Brad also added a feature to WPILIB to make that even easier. Namely the ability to create virtual blinders for the camera to shut off sections of the CCD to ignore a items from the field of view.

I honestly don't believe that there is anything you can't do in easyC that is applicable to FIRST other than a "Because I Can" type item.

[Tom Bottiglieri]

Let's look at training wheels for a bicycle.

Not very useful for someone who knows how to ride well.
Indispensable for people who are just starting.

EasyC parallels this train of thought.

[LightWaves1636]

For experienced programmers, most likely their preference would be MPLab or something else. For rookies and people who are just beginning to learn C, I think EasyC would be a great way to teach them(especially since the people who do know C are graduating and no else on the team knows how to). Our programmer was teaching it to some of our team mates but it's hard because they just don't get it(it's just who they are). He's way of teaching is to have everyone to have a laptop and learn, but I don't think he gets it that our high school is the school where the "poor" kids go and even beginning to become an even poorer school(student self-discipline, growth of druggies, lack of motivation, etc. It dissappoints me.). The only people who really own laptops are the seniors who are graduating and going onto college. I think our team, especially after the seniors graduate, will get along with EasyC easier then trying to mess with MPLab on their first try on programming, but we'll see.

[tdlrali]

I agree with most people, EasyC is a great tool for beginners, as it allows them to program the robot without much prior experience.

For anything beyond the basics, however, I want to be able to type my own code with full control over the bot.

[kitscuzz]

EasyC has it's pluses and minuses. Like most of the more basic languages, its gift, that you don't need to understand everything under the hood to make it work, is also its curse. If you really want to know what you're doing, you can't. It hides what's under the hood to keep it simple.

If you decide to continue with coding in the future, you'll need to understand the complexities of what you're actually doing in order to apply it to other machines. Sure, it's easier, and sometimes it's faster, but you won't always be able to use it. It's something that will help you code this robot, but it's a crutch because it only exists for the robot.

Though I should say that I wholeheartedly support it (though I don't use it myself), all I'm saying is that everyone should remember to look at what you're doing in plain C as well, because C you can take with you. It's a great way to get into the code, and into coding in general, and I love to hear about people getting into the mindset for programming through it. I don't really think there's much benefit in terms of the competition for using either MPLAB or EasyC.

[amateurrobotguy]

Someone deleted my thread starter info here.... but man, I sure did create a fiery thread

"Also, it allows experienced programmers to work with students with near zero ability. The can drag blocks while learning C and experienced users can write C code in easyC, Notepad, Eclipse, MPLAB anything and import the .c and .h files into your project."

I disagree fully with this statement. Our experienced programmer IS a student...me. And why would I use easyC for a file editor when I have Multi-Edit v.9.1...the greatest file editor ever made (undisputed champion). Alls I have to do is click save, go to MPLAB, and click build. And I can guarantee that students with "zero ability" will never be able to do any coding that is meaningful. They would have to have ability, just not knowledge.

I would easily challenge any easyC diehard fan to a coding contest and would probably win too. To prove you don't need to be a CS III nerd to learn MPLAB, here is my background...

I am only in CS I (Visual Basic)... and think it is extremely easy...I picked up MPLAB one Saturday morning and decided I wanted to see what it could do I started programming QBASIC when I was 8 because it seemed fun to make games.

This task will give any easyC fan a run for his money...modify the camera tracking routines to a new search pattern, correct for offset issues, auto face the light, compressor toggling, solenoid toggling, desensitize joysticks, and do all this in autonomous as well. Oh yeah, this requires about 15 new variables and dozens of lines of code.

[Tom Bottiglieri]

Originally Posted by amateurrobotguy

I would easily challenge any easyC diehard fan to a coding contest and would probably win too. To prove you don't need to be a CS III nerd to learn MPLAB, here is my background...

I'll bite on that one. So, Mr. professional programmer, what are we writing?

[Ar3a51]

Our team started with easyC our rookie year (Aim High). We transitioned from easyC to MPLAB for the current game. In my opinion, working with MPLAB seems easier to me than easyC, granted, easyC is a bit more user friendly. It all depends on the person I guess, everyone is different.