Stop with the "RTFM" stuff

[Jak DiGriz]

Originally Posted by Karthik

If you don't have the time or desire to answer a question this way, then don't post. No post is much better than some of the rudeness we've been seeing.

It comes down to something simple, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it all. I mean, I know we all get frustrated during build season, but we still need to make an effort to be polite and helpful.

But what if the best answer is to RTFM? I mean, we can't tolerate absolute ignorance. And we should appreciate frankness.

So RTFM now, and RTFM forever.

[Beth Sweet]

Originally Posted by Jak DiGriz

But what if the best answer is to RTFM? I mean, we can't tolerate absolute ignorance. And we should appreciate frankness.

So RTFM now, and RTFM forever.

Jak, I think that it's the sentiment that people don't like, not the phrase. Yes, people should read the manual, it's their responsibility. But being quite so rude about it is just inappropriate. I expect manners and common courtesy out of my students, and I do the same out of the students on here. It's been said before, and I'll say it again. The students in this organization get very adult opportunities, and they are expected to act like adults. I know it's build season, but please remember not to use language that you wouldn't use in front of grandma. (I guess if you say those words in front of your grandmothers, I just don't know what else to say)

[Richard Wallace]

Originally Posted by Jak DiGriz

But what if the best answer is to RTFM? I mean, we can't tolerate absolute ignorance. And we should appreciate frankness.

So RTFM now, and RTFM forever.

This reminds me of Gov. George Wallace's 1963 inauguration address -- both in tone and general offensiveness.

Originally Posted by Beth Sweet

Jak, I think that it's the sentiment that people don't like, not the phrase. Yes, people should read the manual, it's their responsibility. But being quite so rude about it is just inappropriate. I expect manners and common courtesy out of my students, and I do the same out of the students on here. It's been said before, and I'll say it again. The students in this organization get very adult opportunities, and they are expected to act like adults. I know it's build season, but please remember not to use language that you wouldn't use in front of grandma. (I guess if you say those words in front of your grandmothers, I just don't know what else to say)

Well said, Beth.

[meaubry]

Jak,
I don't know how else to put this, so I guess I'm going to be frank with you.

If you really truely believe that the best answer is RTFM - Please do NOT respond to that post - period!

Just simply let the thread pass you by and save your response for other opportunities.

In short, YES - tolerance and understanding IS expected from this community of users.

Please allow other users that can provide a polite and carefully worded response, to guide and teach those that need reminding to review the rules, the pleasure of doing so.

Mike Aubry
Coach
Team 47 - ChiefDelphi

[Pavan Dave]

Many new people have started using this phrase this year so I thought it was time to bring it up again.

[Taylor]

I was thinking about this thread as well, but my thoughts were along the lines of "people are much more willing to answer (sometimes repetitive) questions while giving polite reminders that many answers are found in the Manual."
One note I would make is to check threads before you make a new one. It seems there are about a dozen threads solely focused on <G36> (the infamous 6'-in-opponents-homestretch rule), with many more threads hijacked by this idea. In the first week of the game, there are much more pressing needs (such as designing a robot) than pointing out a flaw in the animation or griping about a rule that will surely be clarified by the GDC very shortly, as soon as the Q&A is up or an Update comes out.
Allow me to clarify by saying it is important to discuss game rules and strategies, but please do so in a controlled, professional way.

Thank you for resurrecting this thread - it's a good reminder for veterans and some nice reading for rookies.

[David Brinza]

It can be hard to distinguish whether a poster is looking for interpretation of a rule versus using the CD community as a human search engine. If the rule in question is unambiguous, the tendency among FIRST veterans is to assume the poster hasn't referred to the manual.

A rookie CD member should be gently prodded to use the resources that are in-hand before throwing the question to CD. I prefer to send a PM to the poster - it's discreet and (hopefully) non-threatening. Tell them that CD members are trying to get their arms around the subtleties of the game. I don't think neg rep points and terse "RTFM" answers is the right way to educate our junior FIRST members. Think of this as an opportunity to introduce the rookies to GP and the spirit of FIRST.

Same can be said about posters with very poor spelling, grammar and heavy leet usage. A PM reminding them that their posts reflect on their team can guide them to better posting.

[Wayne Doenges]

Same can be said about posters with very poor spelling, grammar and heavy leet usage. A PM reminding them that their posts reflect on their team can guide them to better posting.

Amen brother. I'm old school with no text messaging ability. I'm tired of seeing single letters being used for real words (ie r, u, c etc). This is ok for texting but PLEASE don't use it here.
If I see to many misspelt words or really bad grammer I will stop reading the post.
What you could do, if you have a long post to make, is use Word to compile your ideas and than paste it here after you spell check it. Or you could use a dictionary like I do.

As for the RTFM, some posters are trying to lawyer the rules (aka read between the lines). This is a bad practice that could get you into trouble at a regional during inspection or competition.

*jumps off soapbox*

[JoeXIII'007]

A few things from me in one of the best threads I have ever seen period:

• There's Google
• There's the manual
• and there's this amazing forum which lets you

1. search or
2. ask

Now how you get an answer to an important question in your mind is completely up to the mind. Sure there are some days things get redundant, but that is how we all collectively progress and make sure the meek, middle, and strong people have the equivalent chance of getting someplace on their projects.

Short: Every mind works differently, it will do what it must in order to find an answer, and if it is here, we better be happy to offer it.

-Joe

[dtengineering]

While it is important to remind people new to CD (and sometimes not so new) to read the manual, and search before posting, it is also worth remembering that not all FRC teams or team members speak English as a first language.

Those of us who are fluent in English should consider how challenging it would be to keep up with CD if every second post required us to look a word up in the dictionary, or if one year the rule book came out in... oh, say Portuguese, French, Spanish, Hebrew or Arabic.

Jason