Rough Play in Rack N Roll

[sanddrag]

I witnessed some VERY rough play in rack and roll, I mean, back up at 03 Stack Attack levels, and it never got penalized. I mean, it seems like the rules go through a lot of trouble to explain that this is not the way to play the game. I mean, hard hitting. Robots penetrating others, etc.

Has anyone witnessed "the yellow flag" being given? Or even a rough play penalty?

To me, the referees seem scared to give penalties. Lessons Learned 2005 is probably at fault for that.

[Michael Hill]

I don't believe any were given out in St. Louis; but seriously, is FIRST going too overboard on rough play rules? I think we should be able to rough each other up a little bit. It seems that teams have been forced to get a little less aggressive every year. I know rough play isn't necessarily in the spirit of the competition, but I think it's something that should still be allowed. It's a harsh reality.

[xxwolfwoodxx1]

I agree, we were given absolute hell out here in Arizona too. The refs should have been tougher on ramming, I mean at one part our 2-part arm was basically pulled apart, thankfully though it was thanks a little bent metal and was a quick repair and we didnt miss a match.

by the way, what lessons learned in 2005 are you talking about

[NoahOwnsWithTC4]

I witnessed getting the yellow card pulled on our team. I assume we were disabled for saftey reasons and for our robot falling apart a bit, but I don't quite know why we got the yellow card. I still need to talk to Jeff 'bout that.
I also saw our arm get hit a couple times pretty hard which didn't help us as we barely got it working by saturday.

[Luckyfish05]

I don't doubt you've seen some rough play. PantherTech at St. Louis was on the receiving end of some of that rough play during the first or second match on Friday. But I (as I was told by team members) would say that our rough play was not intentional. That's where the line is drawn, many times the ruling could go either way, and this is just the nature of the game. Not to say there aren't rules and <G35> lines those out pretty clearly. I just think we have to remember what's intentional and what's not, and maybe give the teams the benfit of the doubt if we're not sure.

just my .02...

[Sunbun]

If I recall, a few bits of shrapnel fell off our robot today at LA when robots went full throttle on us, which made me cringe a bit. To be honest, though, I've not enough experience to consider certain actions as roughness...

By the way, congrats, sanddrag, for getting runner-up today.

[1359th Scalawag]

No yellow flags were given out at the Pacific NorthWest Regional but I believe I heard that a yellow flag was thrown at the Manchester regional. Not too sure though.

It's a given that there's going to be rough play. But the stuff they'll give yellow cards on is if they go at full speed from across the entire arena and do real damage on another robot.

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

I witnessed some VERY rough play in rack and roll, I mean, back up at 03 Stack Attack levels, and it never got penalized. I mean, it seems like the rules go through a lot of trouble to explain that this is not the way to play the game. I mean, hard hitting. Robots penetrating others, etc.

Has anyone witnessed "the yellow flag" being given? Or even a rough play penalty?

To me, the referees seem scared to give penalties. Lessons Learned 2005 is probably at fault for that.

At UCF, I only know of one yellow card given--to 744, in the match where they were eliminated. (A moot point, basically.) Most roughness penalties generally manifested themselves by yanking a low ringer off the rack, with its associated effects.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by NoahOwnsWithTC4

I witnessed getting the yellow card pulled on our team. I assume we were disabled for saftey reasons and for our robot falling apart a bit, but I don't quite know why we got the yellow card. I still need to talk to Jeff 'bout that.
I also saw our arm get hit a couple times pretty hard which didn't help us as we barely got it working by saturday.

Agressive play is what I heard from the announcer. Good thing you were disabled before the endgame or you would have had 30 penalty points as well (home zone infraction).

[Jeff K.]

Originally Posted by EricH

Agressive play is what I heard from the announcer. Good thing you were disabled before the endgame or you would have had 30 penalty points as well (home zone infraction).

That one match was pretty weird.
We were disabled for another hitting our arm at the same time that the ref was yelling AT US while we were trying to fix the arm's orientation after another robot pulled the arm out. The ref that disabled us didn't do it for a DQ, but for safety, which we completely understand. It was good though that they disabled us. We were also dragged into their home zone by that team when they went for the ramp...

Just saying what was actually going on at the field..

Overall though, LA was pretty fun, very interesting elim matches. Congrats to the Poof Bot Element Alliance.

[Ben Englert]

Actually, as 1072's driver, I was threatened with a yellow card in LA - the ref said something like, "you're one bump away from a yellow card".

Unfortunately defense was all we were really good for this time around, hopefully the arm will decide to cooperate in Sacramento.

[burkechrs1]

my guess would be one reason they are so hesitant with giving yellow cards is because they follow you the rest of the regional. they're pretty serious things. and im sure the refs have the mindset "let them have fun" as long as no robots are being damaged and people arent unsafe, i see no problem allowing rough play. it's been something teams have had to deal with every year. yes, there is a point to draw the line, but i think its selfish to be mad cuz a ref doesnt call a yellow card everytime your bot is rammed. heck if they ram you and get away with it why not ram them back. you'll feel better. plus its all just good fun. which si what it's about. now i may be totally attacked for this post but who cares, its just my two cents. take care all, and remember it's just a game!

[AdamHeard]

After our BB transmissions for the arm gaveway, we had one match where it was 6 armless bots. We were sitting on our side of the field waiting for our partner to drop ramps when the opponent drove over just to ram us. They was no strategic advantage to this whatsoever. Some teams seem to go out there just to try to rough up robots.

[MrForbes]

I think there were two yellows in qualifying at the AZ regional. The final rounds were kind of agressive, but I didn't really notice any intentional damage. Having robots that can reach up 8 feet means that manipulators are going to take a beating...so designing to resist that beating should be part of the plan from the beginning.

Strangely enough, we didn't have any trouble with our arm's 125:1 BB transmission....but the music wire claw did require frequent reshaping, and still needs some redesign or adjusting.

[Jack Jones]

Originally Posted by squirrel

....but the music wire claw did require frequent reshaping, and still needs some redesign or adjusting.

That's what you get for having it tuned to B-Flat