pic: How illegal is that?

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by vic burg

I believe because the tubes are supposed to go through the chute, and not over the alliance wall, that is an illegal move. Along with it being two people holding the tube. Which, it is understandable if she was losing her grip on the tube, but then again, even more reason why you shouldn't put it over the wall.
Unless I am mistaken. But, that is what I recall.

You are mistaken. Passing over the wall is legal, as long as neither the robot nor the human breaks the plane. It was made clear in a Q&A as I recall.

[jacob07]

I would have never believed that robots would actually grab over the wall to get a tube. this picture shows them handing it to the roboti but I was surprised that during actual competition how many people were getting dq'd for breaking the playing field to get a tube...It was a little sad

[artdutra04]

Originally Posted by Steve W

To be different, I see nothing wrong with this picture. A moment frozen in time. If I were a Ref I would need to wait until the tube was released. The person may be bringing it back to the station. There is no rule on 2 people touching the tube. Unless both people released at the exact same time then there may be only 1 person putting the tube on the field.


Just a few observations to open up the thinking process.

Good call.

We don't have enough information from this picture to know if this move was indeed illegal. It is perfectly legal for anyone to handle the tube, and it is perfectly legal to enter the tube into play over the alliance station wall. As long as the human player was the last and only person touching the tube when it was entered into play, then it's legal. It's cutting it close, but it is within the rules.

[timville]

He is correct that this picture would not be a violation...

It would be a violation if the robot touched the game piece as both hands were on the game piece, as this would be entering the piece into play and would break the "human player only" rule.

Secondly, if the robot would break the plane of the driver's station, that too would be a 10-pt penalty, and if either/both of the team's hands crossed the player's station wall/shute, it would be a 10-pt penalty.

Ultimatly, if the robot and the players made contact, it would be a disable and a DQ if I remember correctly.

[kawelch]

Originally Posted by timville

He is correct that this picture would not be a violation...

It would be a violation if the robot touched the game piece as both hands were on the game piece, as this would be entering the piece into play and would break the "human player only" rule.

I disagree... I believe the ringer is "entered into play" when it breaks the plane not when it touched by a robot. Otherwise a tube thrown over the wall at the rack would "never" be in play. Only the HP should be in contact with the tube when it breaks the plane.

[timville]

Originally Posted by kawelch

I disagree... I believe the ringer is "entered into play" when it breaks the plane not when it touched by a robot. Otherwise a tube thrown over the wall at the rack would "never" be in play. Only the HP should be in contact with the tube when it breaks the plane.

Well you are right, but holding it over the playing field would be like holding it halfway in the chute. I

It wouldn't be until the object was completely over the wall. That would qualify "in play", or until the robot touched it if it was half way over...

Otherwise, a person would not be able to put a scoring object into the chute halfway and pull it out.

I wouldn't have called this in Pittsburgh if I saw it unless the object actually went into play and the two people were from same team (which we actually called about 3 times)

[ALIBI]

Only the human player can place tubes into the field, whether or not it is in play when completely in/over the field or when it breaks the plane of the alliance station wall. I have held many tubes over the past eight weeks and can only wonder. Why in the world would it ever take two people to pass a tube over the alliance station wall? Why are people trying to force the issue here and on the field? The Q & A made it clear that the HP can enter tubes onto the field over the alliance station wall as long as the HP or Robot do not break the plane of the alliance station wall. Wouldn't it be nice if GP would take over and teams would simply have the one and only HP on each alliance pass ringers to the robot over the wall, thru the chute or throw them into the playing field instead of using team members other than the HP and/or multiple players passing over the same ringer. I just do not see the benefit to using more than the designated HP or not following a simple rule. If you are not the HP, why would you think that you can pass the ringer into the field by whatever method is legal? If the refs did not notice it very often it was probably because they did not think anyone would have a reason to not follow a couple of simple rules.

[vic burg]

Originally Posted by GaryV1188

You are mistaken. Passing over the wall is legal, as long as neither the robot nor the human breaks the plane. It was made clear in a Q&A as I recall.

Oops, thank you for the correction, Gary.
Sorry about that, everyone.

[Stvn]

I think that they are two human players on two different teams. After all, there is nothing illegal about wearing a shirt belonging to a team other than the one you are on.