IFI Responds to the Community

[Pavan Dave]

Originally Posted by Steve W

To teach and inspire we must set the example. FIRST needs to follow it's own words and set the example. GP is a phrase coined by FIRST and is part of the foundation FIRST is built upon. If you pull GP from the foundation FIRST will become very unstable. I would hope that FIRST is better than not following their own words.

Maybe FIRST believes that either some rules are meant to be broken OR only individuals can practice gracious professionalism because organizations and professional settings make it impossible? Either way I'm going to be disappointed when Woodie gives his GP speech at kickoff because I'll be thinking of my friends in Greenville, Texas.

EDIT: I am not judging Woodie. I am judging the words being preached by FIRST during the kickoff. Woodie's not the only one that talks about GP, but he is the one that introduces the concept and the one everyone thinks of when you hear GP.

[ALittleBirdy]

Originally Posted by Pavan

Maybe FIRST believes that either some rules are meant to be broken OR only individuals can practice gracious professionalism because organizations and professional settings make it impossible? Either way I'm going to be disappointed when Woodie gives his GP speech at kickoff because I'll be thinking of my friends in Greenville, Texas.

This is exactly the sentiment that cuts a little too deep for me. I can't believe that Woodie is a hypocrite. Therefore, I must believe that there is something more to the situation.

Please don't assume the worst about the good folks at FIRST.

[Bharat Nain]

Originally Posted by ALittleBirdy

This is exactly the sentiment that cuts a little too deep for me. I can't believe that Woodie is a hypocrite. Therefore, I must believe that there is something more to the situation.

Please don't assume the worst about the good folks at FIRST.

There is nothing wrong with Woodie Flowers. He is a great guy. We have no idea if he was involved in making this decision or running any of the related communication. There is no point attacking any one person because we do not know who runs what at FIRST. All some of us above are stating is that we do not agree with the way FIRST went about this situation. I hope it brings about some positive changes even though we don't know the full story.

[Rich Kressly]

Originally Posted by Pavan
Maybe FIRST believes that either some rules are meant to be broken OR only individuals can practice gracious professionalism because organizations and professional settings make it impossible? Either way I'm going to be disappointed when Woodie gives his GP speech at kickoff because I'll be thinking of my friends in Greenville, Texas.

Originally Posted by ALittleBirdy

This is exactly the sentiment that cuts a little too deep for me. I can't believe that Woodie is a hypocrite. Therefore, I must believe that there is something more to the situation. Please don't assume the worst about the good folks at FIRST.

GP is an ideal to live by, but not a tool to judge with as Mike pointed out so well. It's also not a very accurate or a just thing to equate Dr. Woodie Flowers, professor and FIRST national advisor, with FIRST the non-profit organization. Woodie is a volunteer for FIRST just like many of us are. I look forward to his wise words every year and I frequently seek out his words through MIT websites and video interviews from other sources, too. There's no doubt that, if given the opportunity again by FIRST in 2008, he'll once again inspire thousands of listeners with his view of the world, GP, and whatever else he might be so kind to share with us all. Woodie is his own man who's goals for our culture are in line with FIRST's.

That doesn't mean he speaks for FIRST on ALL topics and it's a poor assumption to think he has anything at all to do with the recent announcements regarding IFI. Whatever assumptions you might hold about FIRST (and/or IFI for that matter) in this situation, by no means should you allow that to dampen the opportunity to hear from perhaps the most wonderful combination of vision, thinking, and social conscience our culture has ever seen.

Namaste.

[Arefin Bari]

I have read this thread quite a few times. IFI responded back, now let's wait to hear a response back from FIRST. Let's not jump on a bandwagon to bash FIRST or anyone else for that matter. Let's not speak without knowing the "facts." If you say something please have valid reasonings behind it. =)

[Ian Curtis]

Originally Posted by Arefin Bari

I have read this thread quite a few times. IFI responded back, now let's wait to hear a response back from FIRST. Let's not jump on a bandwagon to bash FIRST or anyone else for that matter. Let's not speak without knowing the "facts." If you say something please have valid reasonings behind it. =)

If FIRST issues a statement, I would be very surprised. This isn't a problem like the Banebots failing, or the radios not responding. As of now, there aren't millions of dollars on the line, and there aren't tens of thousands of people involved. Most likely a large portion of teams and team members don't even know about the prospective platform change (Honestly, how many of the people on your team actually get informed of the email blasts or check usfirst.org regularly?).

In all likelyhood, the only people who care are some of the "hardcore" FIRSTers, and IFI. I'd be willing to bet FIRST HQ has seen this thread (or at least IFI's press release), but I don't believe we don't constitute a large enough audience to make a statement worth it. If IFI isn't worth informing, why are we worth informing?

[AdamHeard]

If FIRST changes platforms, they will likely only change to a superior platform. It would make no sense to change to a platform that is inferior.

In that case, there is really no reason to complain NOW. We have no details, and this change is literally years away. How about we wait until we absolutely know what will happen, and absolutely know the capabilities of the replacement before we complain (Same goes for the 2009 control system for FRC).

[ZZII 527]

They (FIRST reps) will probably talk with IFI and whomever the new control system supplier would be (if there is one already, but I can't imagine there not being one in mind given the situation) before they make an official statement.

I agree that it isn't a pressing build season crisis; all the proposed changes are for the 2009 season. So I wouldn't expect a statement immediately. But to not offer any explanation at all would be strange/disappointing. Even if it is strictly a business decision, some other supplier is giving a huge donation or something, I think the explanation is worth something.

[steveg]

Originally Posted by iCurtis

As of now, there aren't millions of dollars on the line.

Here's where I think you're wrong. While I don't know the specifics of IFI's contract for FIRST, keep in mind what they provide to each team for FRC. Also keep in mind the engineers and support that they have at each regional and at Atlanta. That's got to be a fairly substantial contract. Also keep in mind the size of Vex and it's current growth trend. If IFI loses that contract, while it's not a huge chunk of IFI's profit currently, they will certainly be losing out on a large chunk of potential profits.

[Ian Curtis]

Originally Posted by steveg

Here's where I think you're wrong. While I don't know the specifics of IFI's contract for FIRST, keep in mind what they provide to each team for FRC. Also keep in mind the engineers and support that they have at each regional and at Atlanta. That's got to be a fairly substantial contract. Also keep in mind the size of Vex and it's current growth trend. If IFI loses that contract, while it's not a huge chunk of IFI's profit currently, they will certainly be losing out on a large chunk of potential profits.

Releveant

IFI makes their money with Rack Solutions. I do agree though that if FTC does move away from Vex, IFI stands to lose significant Vex sales.

Perhaps SECOND teams can go to FTC events and do sales pitches for Vex?

Originally Posted by dlavery

This is one of the most important statements in the story. For several years, many FIRST teams have been assuming that IFI makes most of their money from sales to teams and FIRST (and admit it, there have even been some less-than-gracious near accusations of price gouging, etc. on these very forums). A few have known, and this statement verifies, that IFI makes their money elsewhere (can you say "Dell Users"? ) and uses those funds to support and subsidize their FIRST-related activities. There is a hidden, but very significant, contribution that IFI makes every year in terms of product development, sales costs, and support to every team out there. This is enabled by their "other business" that most of us do not see (and may not even have been aware of). This is a good story, and helps shed a little light on just how much the folks at IFI put an emphasis on thier corporate participateion in FIRST to help the teams out there. Next time you see someone from IFI at a competition, you might want to just wander by and say "thank you!" - I am sure they will appreciate it. Unless it is JVN, in which case you can just rub his head.

-dave