When is the notification of the 2008 NASA grant winners?

[ShortBang]

so the rookie team near us that we were mentoring, which was a requirement for our second year grant, didnt get a first year grant, and now probably wont compete. does this affect our grant status?

[Cory]

Originally Posted by ShortBang

so the rookie team near us that we were mentoring, which was a requirement for our second year grant, didnt get a first year grant, and now probably wont compete. does this affect our grant status?

My understanding of the grants is that if you are not directly sponsoring a rookie (which you've made an attempt to do), and have expressed a willingness to mentor a rookie were one available to do so, you meet the requirements of the grant.

However, I am no authority on this, and you should direct your question to Cassie Bowman (cbowman[AT]mail.arc.nasa.gov)

[Madison]

Originally Posted by ShortBang

so the rookie team near us that we were mentoring, which was a requirement for our second year grant, didnt get a first year grant, and now probably wont compete. does this affect our grant status?

Talk to your regional director about finding funding for your rookie team. It'd be a shame if a rookie team were not able to compete because they didn't receive a NASA grant, especially considering some of the other folks that are receiving them.

[vivek16]

too bad 2264 was not chosen. Guess we'll have to fundraise more

-vivek

[Boydean]

Our team did not get the first year grant from NASA. I was looking through the teams that did and noticed that most of them are solid schools(meaning the school it self is making the team). Since our team is not 100% part of a school but is a full public team with some partnership from the local technical college(as stated in the form), does this at all effect your chances of getting the grant?

[Doug G]

Originally Posted by Boydean

Our team did not get the first year grant from NASA. I was looking through the teams that did and noticed that most of them are solid schools(meaning the school it self is making the team). Since our team is not 100% part of a school but is a full public team with some partnership from the local technical college(as stated in the form), does this at all effect your chances of getting the grant?

From the grant requirements... "Following your registration you will receive one additional request for data at your registered email. In addition to your application submission you will need to supply the following supplemental documentation before November 9, 2007, 23:59:59 HST. We must receive an email from your accredited educational sponsor (school or other educational entity) endorsing the team's desire to apply for funding, confirming the educational sponsor's commitment to the team, and agreeing to the conditions of sponsorship."

Did that happen? I know in the past, only public school teams qualified and when you fill out the application it asks for detailed information regarding the sponsoring school (enrollment, free lunch %, etc...).

On a different note it seems like not as many returning 2nd year teams got the grant or may not have applied for one. Of the 4 rookies in our area last year got a NASA grant, only one got a 2nd year grant.

[Elgin Clock]

Hahahahaha! I was just told about this team and their win of a NASA grant.

Team 2372 Elgin Public Schools - Elgin, OK

That definitely just made my day.

Anyone know where this (undoubtedly) awesome future team is competing in '08?

[lukevanoort]

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock

Hahahahaha! I was just told about this team and their win of a NASA grant.



That definitely just made my day.

Anyone know where this (undoubtedly) awesome future team is competing in '08?

Oklahoma regional.

[Elgin Clock]

Originally Posted by lukevanoort

Oklahoma regional.

Well.. that kinda makes sense now doesn't it? lol
I didn't realize there was a regional in Oklahoma, or that would have been my first guess... I guess.

Cool beans. I think I'll be keeping an eye on that regional's stats that weekend then. Thanks for the info.

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock

Well.. that kinda makes sense now doesn't it? lol
I didn't realize there was a regional in Oklahoma, or that would have been my first guess... I guess.

Cool beans. I think I'll be keeping an eye on that regional's stats that weekend then. Thanks for the info.

Yup, the Oklahoma Regional is one of the new ones this year. I'm looking forward to seeing it in person and hopefully lending a hand. I'll be sure to say howdy to the Elgin team for you, Elgin.

[Andy Baker]

Originally Posted by JaneYoung

Yup, the Oklahoma Regional is one of the new ones this year. I'm looking forward to seeing it in person and hopefully lending a hand. I'll be sure to say howdy to the Elgin team for you, Elgin.

Excellent, Jane... I'll be there too, volunteering. Maybe we can convince the Clock-man to venture out.

Oklahoma looks to be one of the hot places to be this year.


Andy B.

[dlavery]

I will not comment on any one particular application and why it did or did not receive a grant. However, I do want to make a few observations about the evaluation and selection process, and offer a few “lessons learned” that might be useful to those who apply for NASA grants in the future.

Having been through the evaluation and selection process several times now, I can tell you that the decisions are not easy, and some very tough choices have to be made about which subset of the submitted applications can be selected and awarded. The processes for advertising, evaluating, selecting and awarding grants and other sponsorships are all run by real people. They put a lot of time and effort into making the best selections possible given the various constraints and requirements that are in place. Some aspects of the evaluation process have to be subjective, and are based on the reviewers ability to extract pertinent information from the application provided by the teams. In many cases, teams can improve their probability of being selected for an award by focusing on a few specific areas of the application. Here are few suggestions:

-- READ THE INSTRUCTIONS COMPLETELY AND THOROUGHLY! This one would seem intuitively obvious, but it was amazing to see the significant number of applications that were submitted were it was obvious that the submission instructions were not followed. As a result, the information provided was incomplete, incorrect, or redundant, and the application had to be declined.

-- There are different types of grants available (e.g. “Challenge Grants” and “Growth Grants”). Each type has specific requirements and limitations on who can receive them. Make sure you read and understand those requirements. Many proposals had to be declined because the team was not eligible for the type of grant for which they applied. For example, no rookie grants were available for the Las Vegas regional for 2008 (as documented in the application instructions). Yet we received several rookie grant applications for this event, which then all had to be turned down.

-- If you have received a NASA grant, make sure you complete all your obligations before requesting another one. For example, when you receive a NASA grant, you agree to provide NASA with a copy of your Chairman’s Award submission and complete the entry/exit survey so we can track the effectiveness of the program. More than six months after the end of the 2007 competition season, many teams still have not fulfilled this requirement. Because they had not complied with the requirements of the 2007 grant, despite several request from NASA to do so, many second-year teams had to be declined that could have otherwise been funded.

-- Make sure that you collect and assemble ALL of the required information before you hit the “submit” button. Many applications had incomplete submissions. The most common omission is the letter from the principal (or other authorized official) documenting institutional support for the team. On average, one application in four did not include this item.

-- Put some honest effort into the narrative answers. The purpose of the narratives is twofold: to encourage the teams to really think through all the preparations they will need to maximize the probability that they will have a successful season, and to provide NASA with information about your team so they can do a comparative evaluation. Remember, when you submit an application for a grant, you are competing with other teams for the grant funds. This year, NASA received more than twice as many applications than could be awarded with the available funds. As a result, the evaluation process looked closely at the quality of the grant application. Teams that provided full, complete, well thought out responses to the narrative questions tended to fair much better than those that gave quick perfunctory answers that really did not support the contention that they were prepared for the 2008 season. When NASA only has enough money to fund a limited number of applications, and some show great care and thought in their preparation and others do not, making the choice between them is easy.

-- Make sure your team is actually registered with FIRST! Submitting an application for a NASA grant does NOT automatically register your team – you need to complete that step separately. There were several teams that had to be tracked down and encouraged to register with FIRST, thinking that an application submission was all they had to do. By the time of the evaluations, some of them still had not registered with FIRST, so we had to decline their applications because they were not an official (FIRST-recognized) team.

-- If you are applying for a Challenge Grant, make sure you are registered for the event for which you are seeking a grant. Challenge Grants are tied to specific regional competitions, and if your team is not registered for the event, it does you no good to apply for a grant for that event. Several applications had to be denied for this reason (again, this gets back to the "read all the instructions" part – this was covered in the submission instructions).

Hopefully, this list will offer a little insight into why some of the applications were not selected for award, and how they can be improved in the future to increase your probability of success.

On one final note, if you do receive sponsorship (from NASA or anyone else), say "thank you." This is not an absolute requirement. You are not under any obligation to do so. You will still be able to get a grant if you don’t do this. But it is an appropriate acknowledgement of the sponsorship being provided, it is both a gracious and a professional thing to do, and it is simple good manners.

I am reminded of a team from a few years ago. As the season started, the team went to great lengths to thank a company that had donated $120 worth of safety goggles to the team for their support. They wrote two thank-you letters, sent a team picture, gave a full written account of the successes of their season, and prominently featured the logo of the company on their robot. All of that was very good and appropriate. But the organization that provided them with $12,000 in direct sponsorship never heard anything from the team. And when the head of the organization (who was familiar with the team) asked "were they happy that we are sponsoring them? Do they want us to continue? Can we be there to cheer for them at the competition?" he was dismayed to hear "we don’t know – they have never spoken to us again after taking the cheque" in response.

The team still got the sponsorship for that year and the next. But the people involved with the sponsoring organization never forgot about the lack of a simple "thank you." And to this day, they still remember who was on that team (both mentors and students), and how they had to make excuses for the behavior of the team to the head of the organization. It is likely that they will be slightly less enthusiastic about doing business with any of those former team members again should the occasion ever arise. The moral of the story: You can build bridges, or you can burn them. The choice is yours.

-dave

[Richard Wallace]

Thanks for giving us all a peek into the NASA grant process, Dave. Many teams (mine included) have benefited from this great program in past years. Attention to the points you made above will (hopefully) enable many others to benefit in future years.

Originally Posted by dlavery

... -- There are different types of grants available (e.g. “Challenge Grants” and “Growth Grants”). Each type has specific requirements and limitations on who can receive them. Make sure you read and understand those requirements. Many proposals had to be declined because the team was not eligible for the type of grant for which they applied. For example, no rookie grants were available for the Las Vegas regional for 2008 (as documented in the application instructions). Yet we received several rookie grant applications for this event, which then all had to be turned down.

Apparently not all LVR rookie grant applications were turned down. If I understand Dave's point above, there were some applications for Regional Challenge Grants submitted by new teams planning to attend the Las Vegas Regional, and these had to be turned down because such grants are not available for that event this year, right? One rookie team that is registered for the Las Vegas Regional (FRC 2464) did receive a Program Growth Grant; per the instructions, that type of grant is not tied to any particular competition. So at least on LVR team read the application instructions and followed them correctly.

NASA is the best friend FIRST has, and the total of 165 grants awarded to FRC teams for 2008 is just one of many ways that fact is made clear for all to see. NASA sponsored teams in particular, and all teams who receive any kind of sponsorship (isn't that all of us?) should heed the advice that Dave saved for last:

Originally Posted by dlavery

On one final note, if you do receive sponsorship (from NASA or anyone else), say "thank you." This is not a hard requirement. You are not under any obligation to do so. You will still be able to get a grant if you don’t do this. But it is an appropriate acknowledgement of the sponsorship being provided, it is both a gracious and a professional thing to do, and it is simple good manners.

... The moral of the story: You can build bridges, or you can burn them. The choice is yours.

-dave

[Andrew Schuetze]

Originally Posted by dlavery

-- There are different types of grants available (e.g. “Challenge Grants” and “Growth Grants”). Each type has specific requirements and limitations on who can receive them. Make sure you read and understand those requirements. Many proposals had to be declined because the team was not eligible for the type of grant for which they applied.
-dave

Thanks Dave and I thought that I had read the reqs thoroughly myself. I had not looked at seeking this source of funding since year two back in 2002 but ...
Now giving the reqs the eagle eye in hindsight I see it clearly now , veteran teams could only apply for a Challenge grant to Hawaii Key mistake was the wording that these are good for veterans at a new regional for first year only. Bayou was new last year too bad OKC was not a NASA sponsored regional but they seem to be busting at the seams with STATE money for grants and teams.

Sorry Dave and Co. I wasted your time and mine,

APS