Hypothetical Money Question

[Mike Schroeder]

So I was ( and this may come as a surprise to some) being a good mentor and going over some potential budget scenarios for the coming season trying to get my team some super shifters without breaking the bank. I was wondering, to teams with a tight budget barely making it as it is, what would happen if FIRST decided to up the registration fee again? I know it has been done in the past specifically 2000 and 2004?, but what if your team had to scrounge up $7,000.00 to make FRC happen for another season? What kind of struggle would it put on your teams piggy bank? Is it responsible for me to plan for this or would that be stupid ? For those teams that don’t struggle monetarily would it change things for you?






-Big Mike-

[sanddrag]

"Welcome new members to the Magnolia Robotics Team. Please remove your watches and deposit them here."

Alright sorry, carry on...

[Doug G]

I think it also happen 2002 or 2003 when they upped the 2nd regional registration from $3000 to $4000.

From what I've seen, upping the registration fees has the greatest impact on new teams. For many veteran teams, they have systems in place to raise double the registration fees for a single competition year (ie: $20k for a couple of regionals). An additional $1k won't be as big of a hurdle as it would be for a newer team with less fundraising infrastructure.

Costs will inevitably go up at some point whether it is in reg fees, additional comp reg fees, travel expenses, material costs, etc... We all should be thinking about how to improve our team's fundraising each year to account for this. In business, they use a term, COLA, or Cost Of Living Adjustment. It's similar to inflation but also accounts for parameters specific to a region or industry. For us you may want to define a new term, CORPA, or Cost Of Robotics Program Adjustment. I think you should figure about a 5% increase to your budget each year is a minimum goal (Inflation is 3%). For us, our minimum target this year was $20k. That means we should shoot for a minimum of $21k next year. Ok this was a boring post - sorry to put you asleep.

[whytheheckme]

I'm not the financial planner on our team, but here's what I can throw in as far as I can figure out.

NASA grant right now is for 6k, which would need to be raised to help out the rookie teams.

We have a few main sponsors that kick 6k each, to pay for regionals and travel related expenses. We would need to renegotiate with these sponsors to help us out (this could be a problem.)

If it need to be done to keep the program running, then sure, but otherwise, I think we are all thin around the 'wallet' area of our teams.

(Not to mention I wouldn't mind that extra 1k in my electrical budget for new sensors and toys )

My Non-Team-Official 2 cents,
Jacob

[dtengineering]

I can honestly say that our team would pay a $7,000 entry fee, because, when our team got started in FIRST (and before we had the support of the very generous people at General Motors Canada) the entry fee for the first regional was just over $8,000.

Sure, it was only $5,000 USD, but that was a lot back in the days of the 62 cent Canadian dollar.

Last year a new team started up here in town and had to pay around $7000 for their first regional, as the dollar was at about 82 cents, as I recall.

Now we can hit two regionals for a little less than $10,000!

Weird fluctuations of exchange rates aside, I think that FIRST is well aware that they have to offer a good value at a price teams can afford, and that raising fees raises barriers for both new and established teams.... but if you really want to make budgeting fun, try factoring in exchange rates... our fees for two regionals this week are about $600 higher than they were last week!

Jason

P.S. The super shifters look quite promising, don't they?

[synth3tk]

I'm not the team's financial planner either, but I think we'd just have to start fundraising. Yes, I said start. For some odd reason, we've never even thought about it before because we always got by on our sponsor grants. Even if fundraising doesn't cut it, just contacting two of our three sponsors (the other one being NASA) could help cover a few more bucks. Although in my opinion, we should be adding another corporation/business if we're trying to go to more than one regional next season.

[JaneYoung]

Big Mike,
I don't think any financial planning is ever stupid, esp. when looking at the future.

When LASA Robotics formed the Parent Association several years ago, we set a few short term and long term goals. One of the goals we strove towards attaining as quickly as possible was to always have monies in the coffer to pay for the current year and to pay for the following year. We've achieved that goal and are able to stay one year ahead, planning conservatively and being frugal. It took a bit of time to do this but we stayed focused, even as the board members and students changed and graduated. If there were to be an increase, because of the established organization and planning involved, we would be able to adjust.

That you are thinking along these lines is a boon to your team, whether the fees were to be increased or not. We aren't a team with a big budget, we have to make every penny count, but I think any time you have increased fees/costs, you have to weigh the pros/cons, cans/can'ts - and be able to justify the increase to your sponsors and supporters. They have their own limits, budgets, and responsibilities.

[Mike Schroeder]

I start thinking about this more and more after i posted this, and its not about the planning or the spending i guess its about where does a team draw the line? what if FIRST told me next year i had to spend $7,000 to get my team registered for one regional. i don't know if anyone realizes it but thats alot of money. I put it in perspective for myself, 7,000 is about 1/3 my yearly salary at The Home Depot..... a couple of years ago there was a post here on CD about FIRST being Elitist is that where FIRST is headed. First off we are going to have a new control system next year what if we had to pay more. I honestly think its a turn off for alot of teams to pay extra for FRC when Dave Lavery said during kick off one year there are eighty something other robotics programs. I've said it a few times in this post but i will close with it again, where does your team draw the line for paying for FRC would it be worth 1,000 more, would it be worth 10,000?

[Doug G]

I think that is a big reason why there is FTC (Vex). You can do some really cool robotics stuff within that competition for under $1000. There is no reason why you can't expect most high schools to participate in either FTC or FRC.

A couple of years ago, back around 04-05, I would have said that our team could not get much past the $10,000 budget mark. Now we operate with at least twice that. But I know that is not the situation on many of teams and hence would be greatly affected by a fee increase.

FRC being Elitist? I don't think that is the best choice of words. How about PREMIER. A local team near us (and successful too), dropped out of FIRST after the 2005 season to pursue the MATE competition (I think the won it too). While an amazing competition in its own right, I heard that it doesn't provide the "SHOW" that FIRST does. (Easy for me to say, I've never been to a MATE competition - again just what I heard from one person).

I've had many conversations with folks about where does all this registration money go. I know it seems like FIRST shouldn't cost so much, but it does. Check their annual statement. Sit in on a Regional Planning Committee Meeting. Maybe someday, there'll be a sensible way (media coverage, branding, etc..) to still have FIRST without so much cost to the teams, but for now this is how it is.