G22 Direction of Traffic Hilarity

[Kevin Sevcik]

I expect this to be addressed in the first Update, but G22 has a fun loophole. You're only penalized for breaking the plane of a field line if you've already CROSSED the line. You haven't CROSSED the line until you've gone over it counter-clockwise. So if you didn't need to care about scoring, you could run around the field backwards all match without any penalties.

[jgannon]

Ah, that is fun! I agree that this will probably be addressed in the first update, but it is potentially a useful strategy. In a number of other threads, there have been discussions about the legalities associated with descoring. If you played clockwise defense, you wouldn't have any problems with <G22> while descoring (though <G36> would still be a problem). Any chance this is intentional?

[Jon K.]

Therefore allowing the descoring of track balls and not interfering with the opposing alliances home stretch and also allowing for a little bit of defense.

[LordTalps]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

I expect this to be addressed in the first Update, but G22 has a fun loophole. You're only penalized for breaking the plane of a field line if you've already CROSSED the line. You haven't CROSSED the line until you've gone over it counter-clockwise. So if you didn't need to care about scoring, you could run around the field backwards all match without any penalties.

edit: nm.

[Ragnarokae]

I agree that FIRST will update this, mainly because the first sentence of <G22> (ROBOTS must proceed around the TRACK in a counter-clockwise
direction) says "must." BUT, it doesn't say anything about a penalty.

[Vikesrock]

The rule does not mention which direction the line must be crossed in (to count as "crossed")so I believe you could only drive in one circle clockwise with the rule as it stands.

[Ragnarokae]

<G22> Direction Of Traffic – ROBOTS must proceed around the TRACK in a counter-clockwise direction. Once a ROBOT has CROSSED a LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE, it shall not break the plane of the line by moving in the clockwise direction. A PENALTY will be assigned for each infraction.

You can only go clockwise in the quarter of the arena that you are currently in.

And you are penalized if you cross a line going clockwise.

To my great disappointment, I don't think that there is a loophole.

[Vikesrock]

The loophole occurs when you attempt to go clockwise over a line you have not yet crossed. According to the way this is written it would not be a penalty.

Originally Posted by Ragnarokae

<G22> Direction Of Traffic – ROBOTS must proceed around the TRACK in a counter-clockwise direction. Once a ROBOT has CROSSED a LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE, it shall not break the plane of the line by moving in the clockwise direction. A PENALTY will be assigned for each infraction.

You can only go clockwise in the quarter of the arena that you are currently in.

And you are penalized if you cross a line going clockwise.

To my great disappointment, I don't think that there is a loophole.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Vikesrock

The rule does not mention which direction the line must be crossed in (to count as "crossed")so I believe you could only drive in one circle clockwise with the rule as it stands.

The relevant sections:

CROSSING: The act of a TRCKBALL or ROBOT passing through the plane defined by a line (i.e. LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE) when it is projected vertically upwards. A TRACKBALL or ROBOT shall have CROSSED a line when all parts of the object, while traveling in a counterclockwise direction, have completely passed through the plane.

<G22> Direction Of Traffic – ROBOTS must proceed around the TRACK in a counter-clockwise direction. Once a ROBOT has CROSSED a LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE, it shall not break the plane of the line by moving in the clockwise direction. A PENALTY will be assigned for each infraction.

So you haven't CROSSED a line in Overdrive-speak unless you went over it in the anti-clockwise direction. So if you're always travelling anti-clockwise dodging the oncoming traffic, then you don't get penalized. Again, I think this is a quirk of this early rules revision, soon to be clarified into irrelevance. If I'm proven wrong and it remains legal, though, I think I get naming rights for this strategy. I'm thinking the Kevin Gambit.....

[Vikesrock]

I stand corrected! Thanks. I am also in agreement that this will be corrected.

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

The relevant sections:So you haven't CROSSED a line in Overdrive-speak unless you went over it in the anti-clockwise direction. So if you're always travelling anti-clockwise dodging the oncoming traffic, then you don't get penalized. Again, I think this is a quirk of this early rules revision, soon to be clarified into irrelevance. If I'm proven wrong and it remains legal, though, I think I get naming rights for this strategy. I'm thinking the Kevin Gambit.....

[Richard Wallace]

To quote Tom and Ray from the popular NPR show Car Talk, "don't drive like my brother!"

I think this loophole will be closed.

[GaryVoshol]

Since it could lead to unsafe high-speed head-on collisions, I'd call it egregious behavior. Yellow card at the least, possible disable/dq.

[Koko Ed]

You'll see teams get cutesy about it and go back to squeeze any dominant robot.
Someone always has to test the rules.

[Otaku]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

You'll see teams get cutesy about it and go back to squeeze any dominant robot.
Someone always has to test the rules.

When you get this many intelligent people collaborating to do a common task with a common set of rules, you can probably expect them to look for loopholes and technicalities that can be used to their advantage. It's almost like it's a requirement for being a FIRSTer or something.

[ALIBI]

Remember the starting position. You can not have any part of your robot over the Lane Marker. Since you are all ready past the lane marker, rest assured, if you break the plane of the Lane Marker going in a clockwise direction you will be penalized.

Once you cross a Lane Marker or Finish Line, that is, your entire robot moves over and then continues to where it is completely beyond the plane of the marker/line, you will be penalized for breaking the plane in a clockwise direction.

I have changed my mind, the definition of Crossing and G22 are very specific. Seems like you would be able to leave your Home Stretch one time in the clockwise direction, since you have not crossed the Lane Marker by "traveling" yet, which is in the definition of crossing.

Perhaps this will give you one chance to remove the Trackball over your competing alliances Overpass during Hybrid for eight points by traveling in a clockwise direciton. You can not be over six feet tall while in your competing alliances Home Stretch (G36) which would tend to indicate that if you were bating the Trackball down (over six feet tall), it must be done from the clockwise side of the Overpass. Not sure how to say clockwise here, just say the opposit side of the Home Stretch.

I would much rather see explainations of rules than to have the GDC change them.