Go to Post General rule of thumb: "If it moves and it shouldn't, use duct tape. If it should move and it doesn't, use WD-40.":) - ben_0614 [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Competition > Rules/Strategy
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Closed Thread
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #16   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 11:57
Libby K's Avatar
Libby K Libby K is offline
Always a MidKnight Inventor.
FRC #1923 (The MidKnight Inventors)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Rookie Year: 1992
Location: West Windsor, NJ
Posts: 1,584
Libby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond reputeLibby K has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Copioli View Post
How about the flag? The flag must be placed so it is 75 inches from the ground. Last time I checked, that is taller than 6'. So that means your robot could never do a lap ...

I expect some clarifications on this rule. I will ask a question as soon as the Q & A is up.
I'm pretty sure the flag doesn't count toward the height.
__________________
Libby Kamen
Team 1923: The MidKnight Inventors
2006-2009: Founder, Captain, Operator, Regional Champion.
2010-Always: Proud Alumni, Mentor & Drive Coach. 2015 Woodie Flowers Finalist Award.

-
229: Division By Zero / 4124: Integration by Parts
2010-2013: Clarkson University Mentor for FLL, FTC & FRC

-
FIRST Partner Associate, United Therapeutics
#TeamUnither | facebook, twitter & instagram | @unitherFIRST

-
questions? comments? concerns? | twitter: @libbyk | about.me/libbykamen
  #17   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 11:59
Nate Laverdure's Avatar
Nate Laverdure Nate Laverdure is offline
Registered User
FRC #2363
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Rookie Year: 1999
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 834
Nate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Libby K View Post
I'm pretty sure the flag doesn't count toward the height.
Correct, as per <R13>, emphasis mine:
Quote:
<R13> For the purposes of determining compliance with the weight and volume limitations
specified in Rule <R11>, these items are NOT considered part of the ROBOT and are NOT
included in the weight and volume assessment of the ROBOT:
• The 12V battery and its associated half of the Anderson cable quick
connect/disconnect pair (including no more than 12 inches of cable per leg, the
associated cable lugs, connecting bolts, and insulating electrical tape) on board the
ROBOT,
• Any STANDARD BUMPER assemblies included on the ROBOT that are in
compliance with Rule <R08>, up to a maximum of 15 pounds,
The FLAG is not considered part of the ROBOT (however, the flag holder specified in
Rule <R17> IS considered part of the ROBOT, and is included in the ROBOT weight
and volume),

• The OPERATOR CONSOLE.
NOTE
- Weight limit excludes the 12 volt
battery and Anderson cable half.
- Weight and volume limits exclude any
STANDARD BUMPERS constructed
consistent with Rule <R08>.
- Weight and height limits exclude the FLAG
However, for all other purposes the items listed above are considered part of the ROBOT
and must comply with all other applicable rules and requirements.
  #18   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:28
Chuck Glick Chuck Glick is offline
Gone Fishin'
no team
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 499
Chuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Chuck Glick
Re: How do you get your other ball

You ONLY have to be under 6' in the opposing alliance HOMEZONES. Example below.



If a team is on the BLUE ALLIANCE, they can be above 6' everywhere except in the RED HOMEZONE.

If a team is on the RED ALLIANCE, they can be above 6' everywhere except in the BLUE HOMEZONE.

It is 100% legal to knock the ball BACKWARDS off of the OVERPASS(clockwise). So pass through the opposing HOMEZONE, pause, knock ball BACKWARDS, and go.

Last edited by Chuck Glick : 06-01-2008 at 13:21. Reason: clarification, image update.
  #19   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:32
Nate Laverdure's Avatar
Nate Laverdure Nate Laverdure is offline
Registered User
FRC #2363
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Rookie Year: 1999
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 834
Nate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond reputeNate Laverdure has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Glick View Post
So pass through the opposing HOMEZONE, pause, knock ball BACKWARDS, and go.
Check out <G13>:
Quote:
<G13> A TRACKBALL that has CROSSED its own FINISH LINE must CROSS the opponent’s
FINISH LINE before it can score by CROSSING its own FINISH LINE again.
EDIT: Nevermind, I think I get what you're saying now.

Last edited by Nate Laverdure : 06-01-2008 at 12:37.
  #20   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:37
Chuck Glick Chuck Glick is offline
Gone Fishin'
no team
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 499
Chuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Chuck Glick
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate Laverdure View Post
Check out <G13>:
If the trackball is still on the OVERPASS, on the opposing side, it has not crossed ANY lines. Knocking it backward would be completely legal at the beginning of a match, or initially just to get the ball down for your own use.

People are concerned that the track ball that is on the side opposite of theirs is impossible to retrieve without breaking rules.
  #21   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:39
Taylor's Avatar
Taylor Taylor is offline
Professor of Thinkology, ThD
AKA: @taylorstem
FRC #3487 (Red Pride Robotics)
Team Role: Teacher
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA 46227
Posts: 4,605
Taylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Glick View Post
You ONLY have to be under 6' in the opposing alliance HOMEZONES. Example below.


If a team is on the BLUE ALLIANCE, they can be above 6' everywhere except in the RED HOMEZONE.

If a team is on the RED ALLIANCE, they can be above 6' everywhere except in the BLUE HOMEZONE.

It is 100% legal to knock the ball BACKWARDS off of the OVERPASS(clockwise). So pass through the opposing HOMEZONE, pause, knock ball BACKWARDS, and go.
Unless I'm looking at the drawings wrong, the homestretch extends to the alliance's finish line, which is under the far end of the overpass, not the middle of the field as you have it.
__________________
Hi!
  #22   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:41
Chuck Glick Chuck Glick is offline
Gone Fishin'
no team
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 499
Chuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Chuck Glick
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by boiler View Post
Unless I'm looking at the drawings wrong, the homestretch extends to the alliance's finish line, which is under the far end of the overpass, not the middle of the field as you have it.
True, the drawing was quickly made for basic demo purposes. Fixing that now.

EDIT: Original Drawing Updated.

Last edited by Chuck Glick : 06-01-2008 at 12:56.
  #23   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 12:58
Daniel_LaFleur's Avatar
Daniel_LaFleur Daniel_LaFleur is offline
Mad Scientist
AKA: Me
FRC #2040 (DERT)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Peoria, IL
Posts: 1,981
Daniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond reputeDaniel_LaFleur has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via MSN to Daniel_LaFleur
Re: How do you get your other ball

I haven't done the math, but it seems to me that if the ball is sitting on the rail, and the rail is directly above the finish line then the ball should extend beyond the finish line ... thus you should be able to knock the ball off of the rails by striking the part that is beyond the opponents finish line without your robot being in their "home strech" or breaking the plane of the finish line.
__________________
___________________
"We are not now that strength which in old days moved earth and heaven; that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts, Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield. "
- Tennyson, Ulysses
  #24   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 13:17
ALIBI's Avatar
ALIBI ALIBI is offline
Registered User
FRC #0141
Team Role: Parent
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 271
ALIBI is a name known to allALIBI is a name known to allALIBI is a name known to allALIBI is a name known to allALIBI is a name known to allALIBI is a name known to all
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by boiler View Post
Unless I'm looking at the drawings wrong, the homestretch extends to the alliance's finish line, which is under the far end of the overpass, not the middle of the field as you have it.

I am confused. Page 5 of 7 of THE ARENA. As the ROBOTS move in a counter-clockwise direction around TRACK, the quadrant of the TRACK immediately preceeding the the FINISH LINE for each alliance is known as the "HOME STRETCH"

Wouldn't that mean that the finish line itself is not part of the home stretch? The home stretch is bounded by the finish line. Does that mean the finish line is part of the home stretch? Or does it mean that the leading edge of the finish line is the boundary?

I tend to think that since the wording says the home strech is the quadrant of the track immediately preceeding the finish line, that the Home Stretch does not include the area above the finish line, but rather the area before the finish line.

Last edited by ALIBI : 06-01-2008 at 17:36.
  #25   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 13:25
Kellen Hill's Avatar
Kellen Hill Kellen Hill is offline
Strategist
AKA: The user formerly known as 'hill'
FRC #1746 (OTTO)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 483
Kellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond reputeKellen Hill has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Just like the ball hangs down under the overpass, the ball also crosses over the plane of the homestretch. This makes it possible but difficult to knock that trackball off by turning around once you are out of the other teams homestretch.
__________________
1625 Winnovation Member: 2005-07
1625 College Mentor: 2007-11
525 Swartdogs Mentor: 2011-12
1746 OTTO Lead Mentor: 2013-Present
  #26   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 13:44
Mike1259 Mike1259 is offline
Registered User
FRC #1259
Team Role: Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Pewaukee
Posts: 1
Mike1259 is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: How do you get your other ball

Is the hight limit in affect during Hybrid mode?
  #27   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 14:05
jgannon's Avatar
jgannon jgannon is offline
I ᐸ3 Robots
AKA: Joey Gannon
no team
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,467
jgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Glick View Post
It is 100% legal to knock the ball BACKWARDS off of the OVERPASS(clockwise). So pass through the opposing HOMEZONE, pause, knock ball BACKWARDS, and go.
Chuck, have you seen <G22>? I really don't think that's legal.
Quote:
<G22> Direction Of Traffic – ROBOTS must proceed around the TRACK in a counter-clockwise direction. Once a ROBOT has CROSSED a LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE, it shall not break the plane of the line by moving in the clockwise direction. A PENALTY will be assigned for each infraction.
__________________
Team 1743 - The Short Circuits
2010 Pittsburgh Excellence in Design & Team Spirit Awards
2009 Pittsburgh Regional Champions (thanks to 222 and 1218)
2007 Pittsburgh Website Award
2006 Pittsburgh Regional Champions (thanks to 395 and 1038)
2006 Pittsburgh Rookie Inspiration & Highest Rookie Seed

Team 1388 - Eagle Robotics
2005 Sacramento Engineering Inspiration
2004 Curie Division Champions (thanks to 1038 and 175)
2004 Sacramento Rookie All-Star

_
  #28   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 14:13
flamefixed flamefixed is offline
Registered User
FRC #0219 (Team Impact)
Team Role: Mechanical
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 53
flamefixed is on a distinguished road
Re: How do you get your other ball

Having the very outter edges of the ball, or i read in another thread that 2 inches of the ball will be below the 6ft mark, be the only area for contact to try to knock it down (its a pretty darn big/heavy ball) is very unreasonable.

My take on this is...the rule was worded so you have to knock the trackball down backwards and go all the way around before you can use it to score additonal points. and the rule was just worded poorly. (keep the scores closer, which is an obvious goal for this year because of no possible 60 point chunks at the very end of the match)

Or, being ON your opponents finish line. According to the rules, you have broken the plane and technically out of the homestretch. (maybe this was designed to protect the rack the balls are sitting on, dont want high speed, potentially out of control robots flying around with over 6 feet of leverage. may not end good haha)

Or pure strategy, which would be entirely annoying, though add a wonderful twist to the game.

I think these are more realistic ideas than 2 inches lee-way trying to knock over 10pounds and 40 inches. plus, have fun refs judging those two inches.

just my two cents

Last edited by flamefixed : 06-01-2008 at 14:21.
  #29   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 14:27
jgannon's Avatar
jgannon jgannon is offline
I ᐸ3 Robots
AKA: Joey Gannon
no team
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,467
jgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond reputejgannon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by flamefixed View Post
Or, being ON your opponents finish line. According to the rules, you have broken the plane and technically out of the homestretch.
That's not correct. Breaking the plane is the metric for determining if you're going clockwise, not counter-clockwise. When going counter-clockwise, what section of the track you're on depends on the CROSSING definition.
Quote:
CROSSING: The act of a TRCKBALL or ROBOT passing through the plane defined by a line (i.e. LANE MARKER or FINISH LINE) when it is projected vertically upwards. A TRACKBALL or ROBOT shall have CROSSED a line when all parts of the object, while traveling in a counterclockwise direction, have completely passed through the plane.
We saw this in the human demonstration during kickoff... a robot broke the plane of a line during hybrid, but didn't entirely CROSS it, so he didn't get any bonus points.
__________________
Team 1743 - The Short Circuits
2010 Pittsburgh Excellence in Design & Team Spirit Awards
2009 Pittsburgh Regional Champions (thanks to 222 and 1218)
2007 Pittsburgh Website Award
2006 Pittsburgh Regional Champions (thanks to 395 and 1038)
2006 Pittsburgh Rookie Inspiration & Highest Rookie Seed

Team 1388 - Eagle Robotics
2005 Sacramento Engineering Inspiration
2004 Curie Division Champions (thanks to 1038 and 175)
2004 Sacramento Rookie All-Star

_
  #30   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-01-2008, 14:50
Chuck Glick Chuck Glick is offline
Gone Fishin'
no team
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 499
Chuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond reputeChuck Glick has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Chuck Glick
Re: How do you get your other ball

Quote:
Originally Posted by jgannon View Post
Chuck, have you seen <G22>? I really don't think that's legal.
I did, but I'm pretty sure that the intent of the rule is to keep robots from going demolition derby style and going against traffic.
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How early in the season did you get to test your programming? EHaskins Programming 18 20-02-2007 00:22
How did you GET your job(s)? JVN Career 45 18-02-2006 15:07
How Did You Get Your Sponsor? Summmergrl2298 Chit-Chat 7 30-01-2002 23:40
How to get your picture under your username: Brandon Martus CD Forum Support 0 07-01-2002 09:23


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:24.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi