New Poll! (21)

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Posted by Sam Lindhorst.

Engineer on team #240, Mach Vee, from Jefferson High School and Visteon.

Posted on 4/22/2000 1:27 AM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by PollMaster on 4/21/2000 7:40 PM MST:



Where's the Disney poll? I should ay polls, since that subject should be done in detail with several different approaches...

Sam

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Posted by S. Krussell.

Coach on team #349, Robahamas, from International Academy and Ford Motor Co..

Posted on 4/22/2000 10:06 AM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by PollMaster on 4/21/2000 7:40 PM MST:



The alliances can be frustrating. Everyone we talked to at Nationals blamed their performance on 'bad alliances', including my own team I must admit. There is a feeling that you don't really have any control over your own outcome. On a more positive note, we had a couple alliances that were sensational! So.......my team has mixed feelings about alliances.

Here's what I wish we could do: have an alliance every other year, and go back to the (no alliance) cut-throat version of the game with 3 or even 4 teams on the field.

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Posted by jack.

Student on team #126, Gael Force, from Clinton High School and Nypro(molding the future).

Posted on 4/23/2000 11:30 AM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by PollMaster on 4/21/2000 7:40 PM MST:



I think there is two sides to the issue of alliances.
i beleive that in the long run alliances are a great aspect of first
because of the opportunity it presents to make great friends. in 99' my first year
participating in first my team(126) won the Hartford regional, but accompanying that victory
was a large number of new friends. the friendships made cheering for your alliance and helping
your allinace can be carried out through the remainder of your years in the program. this year in particular i got to hang out with
some of the best people from team 19 from Greenwhich CT(our alliance last year in Hartford).

but on the other side of the coin there is a disadvantage if you have a great machine
and you beleive your alliance is incapable then you can be hindered in performance, but all the more challenge
it presents you with to produce a compliant machine.

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Posted by Ryan Shanley.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Student on team #191, The X-Cats, from Joseph C. Wilson Magnet High School and Xerox.

Posted on 4/23/2000 7:07 PM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by PollMaster on 4/21/2000 7:40 PM MST:



I definitely got frustrated when I drove the best I could, and our robot performed to its best potential, but we lost because our ally didn't perform well. Unfortunately, it is much easier to remember these kinds of matches than it is to remember those where your team scores well because it worked well with your ally, or how you (or your team) got to know somebody new. I think the alliance system reflects the whole spirit of FIRST, and it would be a tragedy to get rid of it...even thought some of us miss our good old friend 'Placebo!'

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Posted by Lewis Sussman.

Coach on team #95, Lebanon Robotics Team, from Lebanon NH HS, Hanover NH HS, Hartford VT HS and CRREL/CREARE.

Posted on 4/24/2000 1:30 PM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by PollMaster on 4/21/2000 7:40 PM MST:



From the point of view of educating young people about the real world, I believe that alliances are a good vehicle. In fact, to further that goal, I am in favor of teams being given a lot more time to negotiate with their allys, rather than having two minutes to try to come up with a plan. This would encourage the teams to think much more about their skills as collaborators. Teams that were better at communicating their ideas and brainstorming solutions would have a distinct edge over those that simply flew by the seat of their pants. I think that this would highlight a dimension of FIRST that distinguishes it from athletic competition, i.e., it's not just about winning, it's about the quality of the experience and expanding our skills and knowledge.

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Posted by Jimmy W. Hodrinsky.

Other on team #175, Buzz, from Enrico Fermi High School and Hamilton Sundstrand/Techni-Products.

Posted on 6/18/2000 8:08 PM MST


In Reply to: New Poll posted by Lewis Sussman on 4/24/2000 1:30 PM MST:



: From the point of view of educating young people about the real world, I believe that alliances are a good vehicle. In fact, to further that goal, I am in favor of teams being given a lot more time to negotiate with their allys, rather than having two minutes to try to come up with a plan. This would encourage the teams to think much more about their skills as collaborators. Teams that were better at communicating their ideas and brainstorming solutions would have a distinct edge over those that simply flew by the seat of their pants. I think that this would highlight a dimension of FIRST that distinguishes it from athletic competition, i.e., it's not just about winning, it's about the quality of the experience and expanding our skills and knowledge.


As an educator, and having participated in FIRST for over five years, I agree with most of what you say. However, additional time for strategy would reduce the amount of time availble for actual contests. Good scouting prior to matches to know the capabilities and strategy of your competitors prior to actual competition can shorten the amount of time needed to develop an effective plan. After all the effort that has gone in to creating the solution to the problem, we need to find more ways to increase the available matches. Going to a small regional gets your robot more opportunities to play the game, and improve performance.

Another improvement that might enhance the Alliance concept is to require that all three alliances play if a third match is required in the Finals. This would increase the importance of the third pick, allow them to play, and require some serious decisions regarding who is chosen, and in which match they would participate.

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Posted by Erin.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Student on team #1, The Juggernauts, from Oakland Technical Center-Northeast Campus and 3-Dimensional Services.

Posted on 6/19/2000 6:57 AM MST


In Reply to: Re: New Poll posted by Jimmy W. Hodrinsky on 6/18/2000 8:08 PM MST:



Where was this posted? I would like to first ask.

Secondly, I believe that only having 2 minutes before each round has many positive points. It encourages each team to do their best scouting and it also requires the drive team to have enough knowledge about each and their own robot so that they can effectively communicate strategies to others. This makes the team have to work together more as a whole; if the scouting team does not work hard, the work they did will not pay off. If they did work hard and communicate info to their drive team, it will pay off. I believe that having to 'fly-by-the-seat of your pants' is something that will happen to everyone in real life. I think that if FIRST gave us more time, it would be just too easy, while limiting the time is, actually, teaching us a life skill.
Props to the drivers who successfully strategize and utilize those 2 minutes.

-Erin

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Posted by Lewis Sussman.

Coach on team #95, Lebanon Robotics Team, from Lebanon NH HS, Hanover NH HS, Hartford VT HS and CRREL/CREARE.

Posted on 6/19/2000 7:56 AM MST


In Reply to: Re: New Poll posted by Erin on 6/19/2000 6:57 AM MST:



Thanks for the replies, Jimmy and Erin. Erin, this post was in response to a poll asking whether we thought alliances were a good thing, several weeks ago. Just for the sake of discussion, here's my response. Jimmy, please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the alliances for the qualifying rounds pre-deterimined? In that case, if we knew what they were from the start, negotiations could be taking place during the matches, not in between, so there would be no additional time needed. Erin, I think the 'seat of the pants' factor is rampant during the competitions anyway, what with 'bots breaking down constantly and never quite knowing what the opposing alliance is going to throw at you. I feel that in the real world, the ability to communicate well, with an open mind to all possibilities, creatively, is a valuable skill that should be encouraged and not compressed. Think of it as two competing engineering companies deciding to pool their resources to solve a problem which has some overarching benefit to society. I'd like to see these skills explored in more depth at First competitions. Not to disparage scouting. I just think that scouting is something different.

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Posted by Erin.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Student on team #1, The Juggernauts, from Oakland Technical Center-Northeast Campus and 3-Dimensional Services.

Posted on 6/19/2000 10:03 PM MST


In Reply to: Re: New Poll posted by Lewis Sussman on 6/19/2000 7:56 AM MST:



I agree, however when the robots are breaking down, only a certain amount of kids are actually getting to find out the 'seat of the pants' kind of life. The rest of us who work behind the scenes (myself sadly included) never get a chance to work on the robot therefore our 'fly by the seat of the pants' moments are when we find out our alliance and get to have fun telling our drive team everything we know about them. Besides, where would all of this top-of-my-head knowledge go to? It would be worthless with time to prepare.
I also liked your suggestion about 'pooling the resources', however, I believe that is best learned during our six weeks.
But I see the light on your side of the tunnel.

-Erin

-Erin