Scoring incorrect

[Rick TYler]

Originally Posted by Bharat Nain

That says nothing about their experiences in FIRST though. There are mentors in FIRST who never post or read CD and I would listen to them any day over most people on CD.

Yep. It's just that this particular post didn't sound like a wise old mentor making a sagacious comment. It sounded like an irritated teenager. I freely admit that I might be wrong, &c.

Bitterly complaining about scoring and officiating is a perennial feature of CD, at least in the four seasons I've been reading it. Remember the near-hysterical criticism of scoring mistakes and 30-point penalties in 2005? I need to go dig up some quotes from those old threads to help people put Overdrive in perspective.

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by CrazyBear

This was brought up on the 2008 Florida Regional thread.

To summarize, view the drastic change in score at 1:50 for Finals Match 1 at the Florida Regional.

I am more interested in the reason for the large discrepancy of the score during matches. I know that I do not want to win nor lose because of a miss-score. I just want to know what really happened.

I had to watch it a few times to see what was happening. Swamp drops a ball, and it rolls across the line. The ref pushed the wrong button and scored it as a hurdle. After everyone is over in the corner, the ref corrected the score, taking away 8 points (and presumably adding 2, although you can't tell because robots were crossing the line at the same time). Then unfortunately another hurdle is removed by mistake.

[AcesPease]

Originally Posted by Rick TYler

It's just about impossible for a Scorekeeper to display the wrong score. The scorekeeper doesn't enter laps or hurdles, they are done automatically based on counters and the data entry pads held by the referees. The only time the scorekeeper actually changes the scoring is by entering the number of penalties and G14 bonus scores at the end of the match, or by entering corrections to the lap scores (which the refs give to the scorekeeper). In this year's game, there is no scoring actually done by the scorekeepers. So, "putting the final score up" incorrectly can only be done if the scorekeepers don't wait for adjustments from the referees before pushing the "commit score" button. This would only happen once! Not to be a "blame them" kind of person, but in "Overdrive" any scoring mistakes would most likely be with the refs or the electronics, since the scorekeepers would have to really, really try to display any score other than what the refs intended.

Rick "Trained scorekeeper" TYler

I think I misunderstood the poll. We had two quarter finals where the penalties were deducted from the wrong alliance causing the offending alliance to be reported as the winner of the round. Both scores were then corrected.

[Joe Ross]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

I had to watch it a few times to see what was happening. Swamp drops a ball, and it rolls across the line. The ref pushed the wrong button and scored it as a hurdle. After everyone is over in the corner, the ref corrected the score, taking away 8 points (and presumably adding 2, although you can't tell because robots were crossing the line at the same time). Then unfortunately another hurdle is removed by mistake.

This was covered in the Florida regional thread. The hurdle before the one that was dropped also did not count because 179 touched the ball before it touched the ground. It just did not get corrected until later.

[smurfgirl]

I don't believe our team was in any misscored matches. However, we also were getting fairly high scores, so none of us were really that worried about watching exactly how many points we obtained. The drivers would ask how many hurdles they got, and I would answer "a lot".

[robochick1319]

I have to say that I never saw a match miscalculated (or at least where a team lost dramatically because of it)

I will warn teams to be careful when they attach the flags to their robots. At Peachtree we were warned several times to attach our flags correctly (black wire to black wire) or else suffer the consequences of laps that didn't count.

BIG KUDOS to the crew down at Peachtree because even with the weather, the problems, and the complicated scoring, all of the volunteers did an awesome job reffing and judging. I seriously thought it was a well-run regional.

On another note, I would advise teams to assign a member of their group to calculate the number of hurdles, lines crossed, and balls pushed in the match to calculate the score (at least a guesstimate!) As the RoboCoach when the hybrid mode is over I personally keep track of how much our team does as well as penalties. While I didn't catch everything, it was still pretty obvious who won or at least where our score ended up.

Good Luck guys!!!

[Molten]

Why don't we get instant replay? Just make a video for people to refer to when they think something is wrong. Have one ref who is there just to review the footage with teams that would like to challenge the score. We have the technology to do this and it wouldn't be that hard to work out. As long as we limited each team to 1 challenge or something it would not be too time consuming.

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by Molten

Why don't we get instant replay? Just make a video for people to refer to when they think something is wrong. Have one ref who is there just to review the footage with teams that would like to challenge the score. We have the technology to do this and it wouldn't be that hard to work out. As long as we limited each team to 1 challenge or something it would not be too time consuming.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=40383

[math4origami]

I think the finals 3 match of svr was probably misscored.

[Daniel Bathgate]

Originally Posted by Rick TYler

It's just about impossible for a Scorekeeper to display the wrong score. The scorekeeper doesn't enter laps or hurdles, they are done automatically based on counters and the data entry pads held by the referees. The only time the scorekeeper actually changes the scoring is by entering the number of penalties and G14 bonus scores at the end of the match, or by entering corrections to the lap scores (which the refs give to the scorekeeper). In this year's game, there is no scoring actually done by the scorekeepers. So, "putting the final score up" incorrectly can only be done if the scorekeepers don't wait for adjustments from the referees before pushing the "commit score" button. This would only happen once! Not to be a "blame them" kind of person, but in "Overdrive" any scoring mistakes would most likely be with the refs or the electronics, since the scorekeepers would have to really, really try to display any score other than what the refs intended.

Rick "Trained scorekeeper" TYler

If that is so, how come our alliance's score before it was corrected in our first qualification match was odd? One note: SVR did not use the IR lap counters and was counting all laps by hand, and the scorekeeper requested to see the list of red laps again to correct the score. I'm sure the counting laps as one point each wasn't intentional by any party, so it is certainly possible for the scorekeeper to misscore a game (especially early on Friday).

Perhaps a good practice would be for all teams to pay extra attention to the score of their first match on Friday to help make the rest of the matches go smoothly and correctly.

[Rick TYler]

Originally Posted by Daniel Bathgate

If that is so, how come our alliance's score before it was corrected in our first qualification match was odd?

The scorekeeping software has a manual adjustment function, which allows the scorekeeper to enter a total manually. Sounds like the scorekeeper made a mistake. (Please, Lord, don't let it be me next time...)

[Daniel Bathgate]

Originally Posted by Rick TYler

The scorekeeping software has a manual adjustment function, which allows the scorekeeper to enter a total manually. Sounds like the scorekeeper made a mistake. (Please, Lord, don't let it be me next time...)

Ah. I was curious as to how that worked. Scorekeeping must be one horrible job - no one even thinks of it unless something goes horribly wrong, at which point everyone is angry (of which I've certainly been guilty). Good luck with your scoring and thanks for volunteering in such an important position!