Why must Apple draw me towards them?

[Joe Matt]

Originally Posted by IndySam

Well when Mac comes out with a new OS they simply say if your old equipment doesn't work too bad buy new stuff. It's easy to keep things stable that way.

When you are a small player you can get away with that, Microsoft doesn't have that option.

And this isn't how it is with Vista?

The current OS, 10.5, is supported by machines that came out in 2002-2003 (includes the low end machines too). Can you run Vista on your computer from 2002 without much upgrades the same way I can run 10.5 on my 3 year old PowerBook?

Fear
Uncertainty
Doubt

[artdutra04]

Originally Posted by squirrel

I'm low budget, so until they make that offer at $499 I'll stick to the cheap windows based machines...mostly building my own.

http://store.apple.com/us/browse/hom...amily/mac_mini

[wilsonmw04]

Originally Posted by artdutra04

http://store.apple.com/us/browse/hom...amily/mac_mini

sorry, with that price, i can build a computer with twice the ram, a real video card (9600GT or better), and a 4600+ duo and all storage medias.

That's the biggest difference between a Mac and a PC. You can get twice the PC for the same priced mac. Mac will never be more than a nitch market until that changes. Oh, and when they start having games written for them again :-)

[NickE]

Originally Posted by Joe Matt

And this isn't how it is with Vista?

The current OS, 10.5, is supported by machines that came out in 2002-2003 (includes the low end machines too). Can you run Vista on your computer from 2002 without much upgrades the same way I can run 10.5 on my 3 year old PowerBook?

Actually, yes

My mid-range computer that i built in 2003 easily has the specs to run Vista with Aero. However, for even the low-budget or older computers, you could use Vista Basic or just not use Aero

I can use Vista easily on a 5 year old computer, 2 years older than your powerbook running OSX.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by artdutra04

http://store.apple.com/us/browse/hom...amily/mac_mini

That isn't a laptop....and it's not $499 with an itouch, is it?

As for comparing macs to old PCs running Vista, that's just silly! Everyone knows you need to wait a few years before you adopt the most recent MS operating system. I finally upgraded to XP last fall, before that I was running windows 2000.

In the world of linux, the latest release is best. In the world of Macs, the latest release on the latest hardware is best. Windows doesn't work that way, and it's best to accept it for what it is.

[IndySam]

If I was back when I was just doing graphics work and prepress stuff there is no doubt that I would prefer a Mac but most of the printers and software I work with now won't even run on a Mac (half wont run on Vista yet.) The platform is just too limited.

[Schnabel]

The only thing that I can say is that when you buy a mac, be happy with it for good. They will come out with a bigger, better model for the same price within a few months, and you just have to live with it.
Also, for some reason I remember you making fun of me for liking macs, so I will laugh at you.

[Joe Matt]

Originally Posted by NickE

Actually, yes

My mid-range computer that i built in 2003 easily has the specs to run Vista with Aero. However, for even the low-budget or older computers, you could use Vista Basic or just not use Aero

I can use Vista easily on a 5 year old computer, 2 years older than your powerbook running OSX.

As I said earlier, you can have a system from over 6 years ago and it run the newest version of OSX. I said mine just as an example.

I want people to stop lying about Apple hardware and the perceived "you have to buy new to upgrade" BS. It's simply not true and is arrogant ignorance on your behalf.

[wilsonmw04]

Originally Posted by Joe Matt

As I said earlier, you can have a system from over 6 years ago and it run the newest version of OSX. I said mine just as an example.

I want people to stop lying about Apple hardware and the perceived "you have to buy new to upgrade" BS. It's simply not true and is arrogant ignorance on your behalf.

dude, relax. it's just a computer

[MrForbes]

Yup, it's just a computer, and a computer is just a tool to do things.

Plenty of people are die-hard Mac lovers, plenty of people are die-hard Linux lovers, and plenty of people do all they need acceptably well with Windows (like me). Which just goes to show, it doesn't really matter what kind of computer you use, as long as you can do what you want with it.

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

sorry, with that price, i can build a computer with twice the ram, a real video card (9600GT or better), and a 4600+ duo and all storage medias.

That's the biggest difference between a Mac and a PC. You can get twice the PC for the same priced mac. Mac will never be more than a nitch market until that changes. Oh, and when they start having games written for them again :-)

You might build a PC with twice the specs for the money, but I get a computer with half the stress.

I'll attest to the long-term durability of Macs--we had one in a college computer lab for most of my collegiate career, and (aside from a bad call when ordering--get AppleCare, folks!) it was the least trouble I ever had with a lab machine. We deployed four iMacs by the end of my senior year to replace the Dell computers that were at the end of their lifespan, and they are a dream to administer. The four computers (Anderson, Blanchard, Dillon, and Flair--the Four Horsemen) are all ridiculously solid, particularly on the keyboards that take the brunt of most college students' two-in-the-morning-essay rage. Mac OS X is easily locked down to keep folks out of apps they have no business in (Terminal comes to mind), and Winclone allows ridiculously easy imaging of Windows XP on all the machines. I still preferred users to use OS X's guest account, which reverts to a squeaky-clean state on logoff with the right restrictions, but I could just as easily come in and roll back an XP partition in about 20 minutes. (I'll also note that the lab was closed for the switch on a Friday night and open in time for the Sunday night paper crowd. Aside from a wee bit of heavy lifting, the entire deployment was a one-man operation.)

They're a tool, a more expensive tool, but I firmly believe that this is one case where you get more than what you pay for. If I can get folks who begged me to put back in a Dell going on Mac OS X in a few hours (true story) and switch completely after over a decade of Windows in about a day and a half, anyone can switch.

[Joe Matt]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

dude, relax. it's just a computer

It's not about the computer, it's more about the fact people are just shelling out to stereotypes and preconceived notions when someone asks for advice. How would you like it if someone started spouting off half-truths when they ask about your team, school, where you live?

My sister is using a 2001 iBook with Tiger. My one friend has Leopard on a 2004 PowerBook, etc. I've worked with Macs on a close basis for nearly a decade now, I know when to call a spade a spade (sub-par graphics cards on consumer machines? how about the mighty mouse? etc) but I'm not going to let someone get bad advice. It's not about a computer.

[gblake]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

... That's the biggest difference between a Mac and a PC. You can get twice the PC for the same priced mac...

I too have been considering going the Mac route for myself or my children.

I have heard folks opine that with that with a Windows box you get way, way more than twice the susceptibility to viruses, worms, trojans and other major headaches.

Anyone out there care to offer a reasoned opinion about how they compare in the security dimension? Windows OS's do seem to be as leaky a sieve when it comes to security holes. How do Macs compare?

Blake

[Herodotus]

Windows is often unstable not because of the base OS but because of the terrible bloatware that companies like HP and Dell put on their machines. If you buy from a company than you have to delete that bloatware to have a stable environment. If it is a desktop, I would just buy the parts and put it together, and then have a clean install of Windows. I put my current computer together last September and have not had Vista crash or lock up, ever.

However the only problem I have with Macs is the lack of gaming potential and the price. For what you get, Apple is usually WAY overpriced. However, if you aren't a gamer (or already have a gaming rig) and can find a good deal there isn't a particularly good argument against Macs.

[wilsonmw04]

Originally Posted by gblake

I too have been considering going the Mac route for myself or my children.

I have heard folks opine that with that with a Windows box you get way, way more than twice the susceptibility to viruses, worms, trojans and other major headaches.

Anyone out there care to offer a reasoned opinion about how they compare in the security dimension? Windows OS's do seem to be as leaky a sieve when it comes to security holes. How do Macs compare?

Blake

Greetings Blake,
I have been using a PC for 22 years and I have only had 3 viruses. All three were caught and cleaned by Norton. Windows XP is secure as long as you take a few precautions: stay on the brighter side of the internet, have a good anti-virus software installed and updated and don't open any file that you don't know where it came from.

Macs have the benefit of being the "white knight" of the computer world. Folks just haven't seen them as target to write viruses for. This had changed changed recently with viruses directly attacking macs coming on the scene.

As of today, if your primary concern is security, the mac is your choice hands down. If you are more concerned with getting the the most computer for each dollar you put into it, I would personally go with a PC.

@Joe:
It's a difference of opinion; Nothing more, nothing less so, relax

@Bill: Deepfreeze. enough said.