Sport or not?

[smurfgirl]

Originally Posted by EricH

Different people will see it different ways. I think it's a sport for the mind.

Interesting point.

As some pointed out, FIRST is being explained and marketed as a sport. There are a lot of aspects of it that are in-line with the definitions of sports (also outlined in other posts above). However, robotics is certainly not seen as a traditional sport.

My conclusion: yes, it is a sport, albeit a non-traditional one.

[Qbranch]

Robotics is not a sport, but then again I don't consider automobile racing a sport either.

HOWEVER, as others have stated, I'll chime in. FIRST is an awesome outlet for the competitive energies of kids who usually don't fit too well in other things, and sometimes end up barely if ever using their skills.

I only wish I'd known about FIRST my freshman year!

-q

[thehurd03]

in the end, everyone has there own opinions, even if Dean Kamen himself came out and said First is an official sport, people will still have their own thoughts, and ten years from now when First will be switched in for baseball as America's pass time, there will still be doubts as to if First is a sport.

[Kyle Love]

FIRST is NOT a sport. The most physically unfit person in the world could be awesome with FIRST.

Racing in most cases, can be considered a sport due to the extreme G forces placed on the body and the fitness required to be able to do what they have to do. Mainly, open wheeled cars require the driver to be fairly fit. NASCAR, not so much.

[acdcfan259]

Originally Posted by Kyle Love

FIRST is NOT a sport. The most physically unfit person in the world could be awesome with FIRST.

Racing in most cases, can be considered a sport due to the extreme G forces placed on the body and the fitness required to be able to do what they have to do. Mainly, open wheeled cars require the driver to be fairly fit. NASCAR, not so much.

NASCAR is not and never will be a sport. The best argument I've heard is that it's hot and really long. So are marathons but they're running the entire time instead of sitting there.

I agree with what Kyle said. FRC in it's current format isn't a sport because of the lack of physical exertion.

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by thehurd03

... ten years from now when First will be switched in for baseball as America's pass time, there will still be doubts as to if First is a sport.

If this were to happen, then there will have to be a huge shift in understanding among many FIRSTers and FRC teams regarding the importance and value of engineers, technologists, scientists, inventors, and professionals as members of the teams and as mentors. There will have to be acceptance within the community in order for acceptance to be found elsewhere as a national/international sport.

That means the emphasis will continue to be placed where it has been and belongs - inspiring the educational pursuits of the students in these areas and in recruitment on every level, continuing the circle/cycle through generations. Sustaining quality FIRST teams should be an on-going long term goal.

[thehurd03]

I'm going to try and make a Venn diagram in text, with instead of similarities in the middle the middle is first.

Chess is considered a Game and not a Sport, it is because,
1. It involves no more physical exertion than lifting a finger.
2. It is a competition for the mind.
3. You can have John Doe walk off the street, and learn Chess and all the good techniques in one hour

Baseball is considered a sport, this is because,
1.It involves a lot of physical exertion, when your not busy being a bench-warmer.
2. Joe Shmoe can't walk off the street and be good at it.
3. It is a game of entertainment.


First takes from the aspects of a game and a sport in a couple of ways,
1. You don't have to be super fit to be in first, but you can't be all flab either, sometimes depending on the machine your using you can "feel the burn".
2. First robotics competitions can be entertaining, but I know many people that come to learn more about robotics.
3. It draws from Chess in that it is a game for the mind.
4. It draws from baseball in that it takes a lot of training.

Now this might be a silly conclusion but it's a conclusion none-the-less.

I propose a hybrid. Since it is neither sport nor game but draws from both types of competition.

It's a Gorte

Or a half sport

[thehurd03]

Originally Posted by JaneYoung

If this were to happen, then there will have to be a huge shift in understanding among many FIRSTers and FRC teams regarding the importance and value of engineers, technologists, scientists, inventors, and professionals as members of the teams and as mentors. There will have to be acceptance within the community in order for acceptance to be found elsewhere as a national/international sport.

That means the emphasis will continue to be placed where it has been and belongs - inspiring the educational pursuits of the students in these areas and in recruitment on every level, continuing the circle/cycle through generations. Sustaining quality FIRST teams should be an on-going long term goal.

I guess you didn't sense the sarcasm or the wishful thinking in my text.......

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by thehurd03

I guess you didn't sense the sarcasm or the wishful thinking in my text.......

Indeed, I did.
And I saw it as more...
an opportunity.

[Arthur S]

I've always thought of sports as activities that challenge the body more than the mind. I think that robotics challenges mind over body so i wouldn't really consider it a sport.

[Protronie]

Originally Posted by Kyle Love

FIRST is NOT a sport. The most physically unfit person in the world could be awesome with FIRST.

Racing in most cases, can be considered a sport due to the extreme G forces placed on the body and the fitness required to be able to do what they have to do. Mainly, open wheeled cars require the driver to be fairly fit. NASCAR, not so much.

First students train just as hard if not harder than most football players, racers, or any other athlete your likely to find.
Their training is just more mental than physical.
Look at the intent, focused look of the drivers and operators at the matches.
Reminds me of a wrestler sizing up his opponent. Or a high stakes poker player going all in on a river card.
I don't know a sport that requires as much dedication from the athlete as a First student during build season. What other sport only gives you six weeks to get ready to compete? The lack of sleep alone ,add to it the physical building of the robot is as much pressure as any swimmer or golfer, but then you consider them sports.
Like in football, wrestling, lacrosse, and football...
There is blood,sweat, and tears in robots too.
THAT makes it a sport.


IMO yes, FIRST is indeed a sport... and I'll put the endurance of a FIRST robot driver against any basketball or baseball player you care to hand a joystick to.

-p

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by Protronie

First students train just as hard if not harder than most football players, racers, or any other athlete your likely to find.
Their training is just more mental than physical.
Look at the intent, focused look of the drivers and operators at the matches.
Reminds me of a wrestler sizing up his opponent. Or a high stakes poker player going all in on a river card.
I don't know a sport that requires as much dedication from the athlete as a First student during build season. What other sport only gives you six weeks to get ready to compete? The lack of sleep alone ,add to it the physical building of the robot is as much pressure as any swimmer or golfer, but then you consider them sports.
Like in football, wrestling, lacrosse, and football...
There is blood,sweat, and tears in robots too.
THAT makes it a sport.


IMO yes, FIRST is indeed a sport... and I'll put the endurance of a FIRST robot driver against any basketball or baseball player you care to hand a joystick to.

-p

I disagree.

I train kickboxing, wrestling, grappling, etc... (known as MMA).

I've worked hard at robotics, hell, I'd even say In many cases I'm the hardest worker on my team. The "blood, sweat, and tears" in robotics is nothing near a real sport, with real physical exhaustion.

like I said before, it's a support, but still an awesome competition.

[vivek16]

Originally Posted by Jeff K.

Another definition of Sport is:
Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
Human players do get fairly physical, and so do drivers as they get robots on and off the field and while driving. The pit crew joins them in getting physical as they work on the robot. Scouts get physical as they go around the pits. Rules, game rules we are given each year.

I get physical while building the robot. Things often need a bit of "persuasion".

I think that although robotics is not exactly a sport, it should get all the recognition that sports get, all the privileges sporting teams get, and more.

-vivek

[JohnBoucher]

"Sports" are nothing more than entertainment. There is no "VALUE" created beyond the entertainment. It doesn't make our cars run cleaner, grow better crops or clean polluted water.

FIRST creates value. FIRST makes society better through this collaboration between mentors and students. The FIRST program allows both the students and mentors to see the possibilities. It gives value in both directions.

The lessons of FIRST in the short term makes you a better student. The long term value is in how you react to the challenges that you will face in life. As a student you took on an impossibly hard challenge with an impossible time constraint and made it happen. That lesson will serve you well in the future.

Not Sport

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by Protronie

First students train just as hard if not harder than most football players, racers, or any other athlete your likely to find.
Their training is just more mental than physical.

By that criteria, engineering and surgery are sports. Along with most any other profession and many hobbies.

FIRST has sport-like qualities: the competition to be sure. But how many times have you heard that the best thing about sports is the character building that goes on? FIRST has that too.

That doesn't make it a sport, any more than the teamwork, dedication and effort make playing in a symphony orchestra a sport.

Let's leave it at what it is - a great tool for inspiration and learning. With a heck of a lot of fun along the way.