HDPE or ICE FLOOR

[Lowfategg]

I would use some sort of gummy or rubber (like soft rubber) wheels.

(hey you never know with those type of wheels you might be able to do burnouts on HDPE)

[=Martin=Taylor=]

Saw blades.


Isn't that what Bond's car used in Die another Day to get traction on the ice? Q knows how its done.

[Katie_UPS]

Whats HDPE?

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by Katie_UPS

Whats HDPE?

HDPE stands for High-Density Polyethylene. It is a hard plastic used for all sorts of things.

As mentioned in this thread FIRST has previously used ramps made of HDPE as obstacles. The diffuser panel for the 2007 light box was a sheet of HDPE if your team still has that sitting around the shop.

[Bryan Herbst]

I would probably say ice is not a possibility, for two reasons.
First, maintenance between matches would be annoying. Zambonis?
Second, not all venues are capable of doing that. Also because of this, most off-season events wouldn't happen.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by Tanis

I would probably say ice is not a possibility, for two reasons.
First, maintenance between matches would be annoying. Zambonis?

Ahhhh....that explains the first part of Game Hint #2!

[dtengineering]

Okay... I really like the saw blade idea, and will always cast my ballot in Q's camp. But I doubt they'd make it through tech.

So although my fellow Canadians may strip me of my citizenship for letting out this little piece of information, nothing grips ice quite like broomball shoes. Bet you didn't even know broomball was a sport. (Well, aside from those of you in the other snowy bits of the world.) Mind you, from my experience a key aspect of broomball involves beverages that would be out of place at an FRC competition.... so my impression of the outstanding grip of broomball shoes may be... um... imprecise... at best.

On the other hand, Moon Boots (http://www.moon-boots.com/) also had very good grip on the ice. I had a pair back in the 80's that not only kept my toes warm in -40 but almost never slipped. Of course, I doubt the ones they make now would be nearly as good. I'm getting old enough to start to be grumpy that way.

Now someone just needs to wrap them around a set of AM or IFI traction wheels and the ice races are on!

Jason

P.S. HDPE = High Density PolyEthylene. Not so different from what 4L milk jugs (I guess gallon jugs for most of the CD community) are made from. A relatively low-fiction polymer (plastic) with almost a waxy finish, usually (but certainly not always) white in colour. It has a longer molecular chain than the Low Density Polyethylene in the milk jugs, and a higher tensile strength, but has a similar feel to it.

[samir13k]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

Okay... I really like the saw blade idea, and will always cast my ballot in Q's camp. But I doubt they'd make it through tech.

So although my fellow Canadians may strip me of my citizenship for letting out this little piece of information, nothing grips ice quite like broomball shoes. Bet you didn't even know broomball was a sport. (Well, aside from those of you in the other snowy bits of the world.) Mind you, from my experience a key aspect of broomball involves beverages that would be out of place at an FRC competition.... so my impression of the outstanding grip of broomball shoes may be... um... imprecise... at best.

Broomball... Like Curling?

Also, take some thick sheet metal, curv it around kitbot wheels, and sharpen them so that they are like ice blade "blades". Maybe even for braking you can make them slide sideways and kick up all that ice...

....except they would prolly go with HDPE

[gorrilla]

conveyor belts for traction,

luckily we are only miles from g&t conveyor systems (they make airline baggage handeling things)

[Pat McCarthy]

We certainly know the idea has been floating around in the GDC's heads for a few years:


http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/22422

[Cory]

Originally Posted by gorrilla

conveyor belts for traction,

luckily we are only miles from g&t conveyor systems (they make airline baggage handeling things)

Like I said earlier, surface area doesn't matter.

HDPE and ice are as close as possible to an "ideal" surface from a physics standpoint. The reason surface area might matter on carpet is because the tread can interlock with the carpet.

On ice or HDPE the surface is totally slick, so there is no possible way for the tread to interlock with the HDPE, and thus surface area does not matter, only coefficient of friction and normal force.

[maltz1881]

HDPE is what milk jugs are made of. We have made several robots out of HDPE. Very easy to work with and we keep lots of it on hand. Very strong and durable.

[Gdeaver]

For the stack attack game, we found that McMaster-Carr Grip all neoprene rubber had very good traction on HDPE. Our problem was that it gripped to well on carpet (4" wide wheel). If we had less width and more power than the drill motors it would have worked well.

[gorrilla]

Originally Posted by Cory

Like I said earlier, surface area doesn't matter.

HDPE and ice are as close as possible to an "ideal" surface from a physics standpoint. The reason surface area might matter on carpet is because the tread can interlock with the carpet.

On ice or HDPE the surface is totally slick, so there is no possible way for the tread to interlock with the HDPE, and thus surface area does not matter, only coefficient of friction and normal force.

the conveyor belts they make are for moving bags around an airport, they are a like tiny little plastic plates with rubber tread on them, were you thinking like timing belt kinda thing?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by gorrilla

the conveyor belts they make are for moving bags around an airport, they are a like tiny little plastic plates with rubber tread on them, were you thinking like timing belt kinda thing?

Traction is directly related to frictional force. Force = mu * N, where mu is the coefficient of friction and N is the normal force (force directed directly away from a surface that something with friction is on). Notice the lack of area in that equation? Yep, there's a reason for that. Namely, surface area doesn't matter.

There's been discussion of this issue already, some years ago. Look it up.

And, the only way to increase mu is to increase the coefficient of friction. You can a) change materials or b) dig one material into the other. If you try doing b) to an HDPE section of the field, I'll call a rules violation, assuming there is a "no damaging the field" rule again.