CH Flight Stick Compatibility with 2009 System?

[Cory]

Originally Posted by artdutra04

The new USB joysticks in the 2009 KoP are much better than even modified CH Flightsticks.

Not only do they have very stiff springs, but the buttons on them are actually conveniently placed. I wouldn't hesitate one bit to use them on an operator interface; and the fact that you can buy additional ones relatively easily for about $20 each is a major win in my books. And this is coming from someone who used to love the old CH Flightsticks.

If you have the serial Flightsticks, get a wiring diagram for the serial connector, and just rewire the pins onto female pin headers and plug them into the appropiate (e.g. power, ground, digital input, analog input, etc) additional male pins on the Driver Station.

Interesting. Our three teams involved in the beta test (100, 254, 668) all agreed long ago that the Logitech joysticks, while better than the white ones of late, still can't touch the original CH Flightstick. We might use them for an arm, but we'd beg borrow or steal the original Flightstick first.

To your second point, you'll also needs to add some resistors to the driver station. I believe this has been explained elsewhere.

[wilsonmw04]

Originally Posted by Cory

Interesting. Our three teams involved in the beta test (100, 254, 668) all agreed long ago that the Logitech joysticks, while better than the white ones of late, still can't touch the original CH Flightstick. We might use them for an arm, but we'd beg borrow or steal the original Flightstick first.

Man, I don't know where you are coming from. My team found some old CH's in a set of materials from a defunct team. I have to say the new sticks are better than the CH's or the white sticks by leaps and bounds. The return, sensitivity, hand feel and buttons make them superior, IMO. If it had three axises, we'd be all over it. We're going to try a Saitek Cyborg Gold for Mechanum control. It should be very enlightening.

[Cory]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

Man, I don't know where you are coming from. My team found some old CH's in a set of materials from a defunct team. I have to say the new sticks are better than the CH's or the white sticks by leaps and bounds. The return, sensitivity, hand feel and buttons make them superior, IMO. If it had three axises, we'd be all over it. We're going to try a Saitek Cyborg Gold for Mechanum control. It should be very enlightening.

I guess I'm just old school. It isn't just me though. Practically everyone I know loves the Flightstick.

[artdutra04]

Originally Posted by Cory

To your second point, you'll also needs to add some resistors to the driver station. I believe this has been explained elsewhere.

...so they didn't build pull-up/down resistors into the driver station?

[Cory]

Originally Posted by artdutra04

...so they didn't build pull-up/down resistors into the driver station?

Nope. We were surprised as well when we went to hook everything up during the beta test.

[ParkerF]

Just from my experiences with the old school CHs on a 6WD, I'd take them any day over the Kit joysticks. I know arm driving is a different story, but button placement isn't that important for a base driver, and the left throttle wheel is great for shifting with your thumb without disturbing the stick position. Maybe it's just how I held them.

[Kingofl337]

I think the biggest complaint with the "old" stuff the joysticks don't auto center. But, either way I have a solution for everyone who wants to have a genuine USB HID CH Flightstick Build a HID USB Device

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Kingofl337

I think the biggest complaint with the "old" stuff the joysticks don't auto center. But, either way I have a solution for everyone who wants to have a genuine USB HID CH Flightstick Build a HID USB Device

Auto-centering may be overrated. Especially if you're not expecting it. See here.

As to making an adapter for analog joysticks, remember that the pots in the joysticks don't work as voltage dividers, they work as variable resistances. Directly connecting the X-axis pin to an analog input isn't likely to work well. To get the pots to work linearly, you'll need to build a constant current power supply to draw approximately 50 micro-amps through the pot from 5V. You should be able to make one with a few resistors and transistors, but the point is that getting true linear response out of the joystick isn't going to be simple.

Alternatively, you can create a sort of voltage divider out of it by jumping the joystick signal to ground through a resistor. The problem here is that you're not going to get a perfectly linear response from the joystick. I've attached a picture of what it'd look like with different resistor values. It gets more linear with higher resistance, but you end up with more noise and a reduced overall range you're reading from. With the 500K, you're reading from 4.166V to 5V. With 100K, it's 2.5V to 5V. This obviously reduces your resolution. The analog inputs are 10-bit, so a 100K resistor would knock you down to 9-bit resolution. A 200K resistor would put you a little over 8-bit resolution. Practically speaking, it'd make the most sense to bust open the Flightstick and see if you can re-wire the pots as voltage dividers. If you can't, then I'd recommend grabbing a copy of The Art of Electronics, or weaning yourself off the Flightsticks as best you can. Given the plethora of joysticks out there, I find it hard to believe you can't find one you like.

[Tom Bottiglieri]

I can't imagine swapping the encoders from a USB HID stick to the CH flightsticks would be an unachievable task. FrankenSticks to the rescue.

On a side note, from the discussion thus far I am in the FlightStick camp. Whether or not the hassle of getting them to work reliably on the 09 controls is worth it is a different story.

[Dave Flowerday]

You all know that CH makes USB flightsticks, right? The Flightsticks are almost certainly better than the Logitech ones - CH makes joysticks for "real" applications like controlling large machinery, planes, etc. Hence the somewhat hefty pricetag that they come with.

http://www.chproducts.com/retail/joysticks.html

As indicated on their website, they don't require a driver and therefore do work with the DS. They also have some fancier sticks (FighterStick and CombatStick) which have extra buttons and a Z axis.

[Cory]

Originally Posted by Dave Flowerday

You all know that CH makes USB flightsticks, right? The Flightsticks are almost certainly better than the Logitech ones - CH makes joysticks for "real" applications like controlling large machinery, planes, etc. Hence the somewhat hefty pricetag that they come with.

http://www.chproducts.com/retail/joysticks.html

As indicated on their website, they don't require a driver and therefore do work with the DS. They also have some fancier sticks (FighterStick and CombatStick) which have extra buttons and a Z axis.

The Flightstick Pro is kinda goofy looking with that big old bulb at the top, in my opinion. We saw those awhile ago and decided we'd use them when we ran out of old Flightsticks.

[Dave Flowerday]

Originally Posted by Cory

The Flightstick Pro is kinda goofy looking with that big old bulb at the top, in my opinion. We saw those awhile ago and decided we'd use them when we ran out of old Flightsticks.

They are a bit goofy, but we used the gameport versions of those for a couple years on our robot ('05 and '06 I believe) with great success. We used them because we needed a few more buttons than the standard one offered. It might look a little funny but it worked well.

[waialua359]

At least the new controllers provided are the closest thing we've seen in the KOP to the old CH flightsticks. The tightness of the movement is much better than the ones in recent years. Whoever wants the old ones, you can have ours. We'd be more than happy to give them away.
The flightsticks were about the only thing left that we kept recycling from old controllers from past robots. We still have 6 perfectly working ones left.

[Mark McLeod]

Originally Posted by waialua359

Whoever wants the old ones, you can have ours. We'd be more than happy to give them away.

Dibs!