Section 4 Posted

[Zflash]

http://www.usfirst.org/community/frc...nt.aspx?id=452

One item that has changed from previos years is the shipping requirements.

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by Zflash

http://www.usfirst.org/community/frc...nt.aspx?id=452

One item that has changed from previos years is the shipping requirements.

What has changed from previous years? The only non-cosmetic change I found between the document from last year and the one from this year is this year's document specifies a bit more freedom in determining which legs you will use the donated shipping for.

Did I miss something?

[Zflash]

If you re-read the entire document and pay close attention to the text in red you will find the differences.

[Vikesrock]

Again, a post saying that "shipping requirements" has changed is quite vague.

The major change I see is that teams can now use what was previously the "home" shipment to ship to another regional if they so choose.

My question is if there is another important change that I am missing? I can sort of see trying to leave your post vague to make sure people are reading the document, but I think it would be far more helpful to be clear. Just about the entire document details "shipping requirements".

[Zflash]

Personally I thought making the availability of the document aware to people was helpful to begin with however I guess in your eyes it is not. My purpose of the post was to let people know that the section was posted so they could read it early before the rest of the sections came out and thier list of reading material got larger. I just threw in that there were some changes I did not know that I was responsible for listing every change in the document from previous years. If an admin sees this post as not helpful then by all means delete it I do not have a problem with that.

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by Zflash

Personally I thought making the availability of the document aware to people was helpful to begin with however I guess in your eyes it is not. My purpose of the post was to let people know that the section was posted so they could read it early before the rest of the sections came out and thier list of reading material got larger. I just threw in that there were some changes I did not know that I was responsible for listing every change in the document from previous years. If an admin sees this post as not helpful then by all means delete it I do not have a problem with that.

That wasn't his point. He's just asking you to point out to him the difference(s) from previous years. Not where to find it, but the explicit difference about the shipping requirements which you observed.

[Zflash]

Teams CANNOT use the FedEx donation for back-to-back events (aka consecutive weekend).

NEW FOR 2009! Teams qualifying for the Championship at a Regional will NOT be given a Bill of Lading at the qualifying event. Teams are responsible for managing how they use their two (2) donated shipments. Event Managers WILL NOT have extra copies as in previous years.

If a team has qualified to go to the Championship at a Regional and they have already used their two (2) donated shipments, the team MUST ship to the Championship through Shepard.

There is your cliff notes version.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by lilstogi11

That wasn't his point. He's just asking you to point out to him the difference(s) from previous years. Not where to find it, but the explicit difference about the shipping requirements which you observed.

Which was bright red in the manual.

Honestly, I read through that section, and the bright red text caught my eye the first thing. In my Aero Design comp, the rules are B/W, and they call out new stuff that way, and we find it pretty easily. FIRST really helped teams out this way.

Vikesrock, would the extra freedom not count as "shipping requirements change"? It could be clearer, but we all know that "I heard it on CD that..." doesn't fly too well with FIRST. By being vague, viewers are encouraged to read the manual, find any changes, and see if anyone else noticed the changes or saw something else different. Hence, they understand better, and FIRST gets fewer "I heard on CD that..." that they have to sort out.

FYI, I didn't notice anything else that was much different from previous years, unless you count the aforementioned red text and the area-specific directions shortly afterwards (which I'm not sure were around previously).

[Alan Anderson]

Originally Posted by EricH

Which was bright red in the manual.

Color doesn't survive being printed on a non-color printer. I had a laser-printed copy in my hand and found Zflash's "advice" to be quite frustrating.

In my Aero Design comp, the rules are B/W, and they call out new stuff that way, and we find it pretty easily.

I don't understand what you mean. In what way do they call out new stuff?

[Travis Covington]

I think the point is that we should simply thank him for taking note of this section being posted, and read it ourselves. It's pretty clear what the differences are. If you couldn't catch the red I imagine the words spelled out in capital letters should have done the trick.

[Zflash]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

Color doesn't survive being printed on a non-color printer. I had a laser-printed copy in my hand and found Zflash's "advice" to be quite frustrating.



I don't understand what you mean. In what way do they call out new stuff?

That is why I provided a link to the word document that was colored. As far as changes for the 2009 season FIRST was nice enough to put in the document the words NEW for 2009! followed by changes maybe these changes will effect some teams and not others that is why I posted the document for people to get out of it what they needed. Sorry if any confusion was caused to anyone.

[merybar]

Thanks for posting this up, very helpful to know when stuff comes out especially for the people that are not on the first distribution list.
Thanks for your help!!
Matt

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

I don't understand what you mean. In what way do they call out new stuff?

"New for 200X:[insert new stuff here]"

Oh, and that could be in any one of the six Aero rules sections. (1 per class of plane (3), 1 for team organization, 1 for competition setup, and 1 for technical paper requirements)

[Alan Anderson]

It seems that Zflash has misunderstood the nature of the changes to the shipping information this year. He apparently felt that teams needed to be warned about new restrictions, while what I'm reading from the manual is that teams are being given new freedom in how they may apply the FedEx donation. Since his team did back-to-back regionals a few years ago, he might be unusually sensitive to the remaining rule against using FedEx's donated shipping for doing that, and might be seeing it as a new prohibition rather than as a limit on a new option.

[Zflash]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

It seems that Zflash has misunderstood the nature of the changes to the shipping information this year. He apparently felt that teams needed to be warned about new restrictions, while what I'm reading from the manual is that teams are being given new freedom in how they may apply the FedEx donation. Since his team did back-to-back regionals a few years ago, he might be unusually sensitive to the remaining rule against using FedEx's donated shipping for doing that, and might be seeing it as a new prohibition rather than as a limit on a new option.

Apparently you misunderstood my intention of posting the release of section 4. It was to make teams aware that it was posted and that is all. It has now turned into a thread about whether I was helping or not by posting it and to me that is truly sad.