Blocking your own trailer

[Richard Wallace]

Originally Posted by dodar

... but some teams are thinking about retracting the trailer inside their robot and then covering the top or covering it somehow or just retracting it in so it is harder to see

hmm ... retract the trailer?

Can you think of a way to do that without violating <R18>D. and R<18>E. ? Look carefully at Fig. 8-6 and consider the restrictions that <R18> places on how the robot is permitted to constrain the trailer's motion.

[edit]see also: Nate's analysis of the fixed trailer hitch location requirement <R18>B.[/edit]

If you do think of a way, it would be smart to post a question for the GDC using the official Q&A on the FIRST forum, to make sure your idea doesn't violate a rule. It would be a shame to base your team's robot design on an assumption that turns out to be incorrect.

[IndySam]

Originally Posted by Richard

hmm ... retract the trailer?

Can you think of a way to do that without violating <R18>D. and R<18>E. ? Look carefully at Fig. 8-6 and consider the restrictions that <R18> places on how the robot is permitted to constrain the trailer's motion.

[edit]see also: Nate's analysis of the fixed trailer hitch location requirement <R18>B.[/edit]

If you do think of a way, it would be smart to post a question for the GDC using the official Q&A on the FIRST forum, to make sure your idea doesn't violate a rule. It would be a shame to base your team's robot design on an assumption that turns out to be incorrect.

I agree with Richard. R18E will seriously restrict any trailer enclosure strategy.


If you guys think that the GDC didn't think of the idea of covering the trailer prevent scoring then you don't know them very well. I think they wrote the rules to make it almost impossible to do so they will not issue any new rule preventing it. If a team comes up with a viable way of doing it within the rules I think the whole GDC will congratulate them.

[JHSmentor]

in response to the robot width being the 38" direction - I believe this is totally legal but it does state in the rules that the trailer will be attached to the SHORT side of the robot. so, if the robot design had the wide sides in the front and back, then the trailer would be sliding along beside it on the left or right.

[bduddy]

Originally Posted by JHSmentor

in response to the robot width being the 38" direction - I believe this is totally legal but it does state in the rules that the trailer will be attached to the SHORT side of the robot. so, if the robot design had the wide sides in the front and back, then the trailer would be sliding along beside it on the left or right.

I don't think there's anything that says that in rule <R18>, the rule regarding the trailer hitch. It just has to be somewhere on the outside of the robot. Is there somewhere else I'm not looking?

[chewy]

Originally Posted by JHSmentor

in response to the robot width being the 38" direction - I believe this is totally legal but it does state in the rules that the trailer will be attached to the SHORT side of the robot. so, if the robot design had the wide sides in the front and back, then the trailer would be sliding along beside it on the left or right.

I did not see that in the manual... see below

<R18>

D. The Trailer Hitch must be located on an outer edge of the ROBOT structure such that it may easily connect with the tongue of the TRAILER (attached to the TRAILER).

[IndySam]

Originally Posted by JHSmentor

in response to the robot width being the 38" direction - I believe this is totally legal but it does state in the rules that the trailer will be attached to the SHORT side of the robot. so, if the robot design had the wide sides in the front and back, then the trailer would be sliding along beside it on the left or right.

please quote this rule?

[tjwoodin]

Well what you could do is create a robot that is really small, then when you create the cover your robot will not go outside the limits since your robot is already tiny to begin with. Also one rule states that you need all balls able to be taken out of your trailer at the end of the match without powering your robot back up so if you were to make something, you would need to make it retractable at the end of the match.

[jstn.mrrtt]

im going to quote bills blog on this one:

"Good Morning Teams,

I want to clarify the Game Design Committee’s intention on a few matters to save you time and resources:
1) De-scoring is not permitted (ie. You may not remove game pieces from a trailer)
2) Goal tending is not permitted (ie. You may not block access to a trailer)
3) Don’t spend time attempting to develop a vacuum car system like Jim Hall’s sucker Chaparral car. Even a slight suction over the base of the robot will damage the field surface and you don’t want to do that (See the 2009 FIRST Robotics Competition Manual section 7 rules G-29 & G-30)"

which in essence says NO blocking the trailer, and that it will probably be specified directly in a team update.

[Jinx]

what about a robot, full size with that fans tucked in against the top? of course i also mean under the height limit?

[smurfgirl]

If you haven't seen this from Bill's Blog today:

Good Morning Teams,

I want to clarify the Game Design Committee’s intention on a few matters to save you time and resources:
...
2) Goal tending is not permitted (ie. You may not block access to a trailer)

If you cannot block access to a trailer, I presume you cannot block access to any trailer, your own included.

So in short, no, you cannot block your own trailer.

[Jinx]

Blowing air isnt blocking as far as we have seen, people will still be able to score and it isnt technically physical blocking... being one to have seen Bill's Blog...

[smurfgirl]

Originally Posted by Jinx

Blowing air isnt blocking as far as we have seen, people will still be able to score and it isnt technically physical blocking... being one to have seen Bill's Blog...

I'd have to say blowing air towards the trailers with the intent of deflecting balls is a means of blocking, no?

If you ask this on the Q&A, I'm willing to bet that the GDC responds that this is against the intent of the rules, and is not legal.

[Jinx]

I guess i will ask...

[Timmyho]

Originally Posted by smurfgirl

If you haven't seen this from Bill's Blog today:



If you cannot block access to a trailer, I presume you cannot block access to any trailer, your own included.

So in short, no, you cannot block your own trailer.

I would consider blowing air a means of goal tending, and since goal tending is illegal blowing air would be too.

EDIT: the quote didn't show, just look at Smurfgirl's post to see what i am talking about

[Team 2811]

If you made a 28"x28" robot then you could have 10" to cover the trailer without having to worry about the trailer touching your robot or the rule about fixing your trailer hitch in one position. This could work if you had no bumper on the back then there would be no backside barrier for the limit in terms of the rule that you cant extend past the bumper zone. If there is no bumper zone in the rear then you can extend out over the trailer.
Think about that