ball cannon???

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Originally Posted by CraigHickman

This is a VERY bold claim, especially for someone from such a high team number. I expect we'll see some teams with frighteningly accurate shooting mechanisms. After all, this is FIRST... and we've seen some pretty amazing systems in the past, many that no one thought could be done.

While I believe the number of highly accurate, reliable, and efficient cannons will be few and far between, I believe there will be a number of very successful designs.

[rvo1000]

As to the launching idea...we have been brainstorming on that and on a way of somehow accurately dumping the balls into other trailers as efficiently as possible, but no way so far. The dimensions are horrible to get around, but as we keep moving forward things are starting to work better.

[Ragnarokae]

I've seen a lot of confusion regarding the humans throwing the balls in.

<G09> TEAM Starting Positions – The PAYLOAD SPECIALIST is stationed in either of the FUELING STATIONS belonging to the ALLIANCE, or seated in the OUTPOST belonging to the ALLIANCE. The seat belt in each OUTPOST must be snugly fastened around the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST seated in this location. The determination of where the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST is stationed among these three possible locations is negotiated within the ALLIANCE before the start of the MATCH.

My understanding: Each alliance has a Payload Specialist in each fueling station, and one in the outpost (who is seated).

<G20> Handling MOON ROCKS – MOON ROCKS can be SCORED by ROBOTS or PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS. PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS can enter MOON ROCKS into play by launching them over the Alliance Station Wall or over/through the OUTPOST shield. MOON ROCKS can not enter the CRATER by being thrown around the end of the Alliance Station Wall. A violation will cause a PENALTY to be assigned.

My understanding: Only the Payload Specialist can throw.
Seems hard (to me) to throw a 9'' ball over a wall and land inside a 10.5'' target.... Maybe the Payload Specialist is meant to just get balls into the arena and get a very lucky shot.

<G39> TEAM Positions During TELEOPERATED PERIOD - During the TELEOPERATED PERIOD, the PILOTS and the COMMANDER may travel anywhere within the ALLIANCE ZONE (note that the ALLIANCE ZONE includes the local FUELING STATION). The PAYLOAD SPECIALIST must remain within the FUELING STATION to which they are assigned for the
entire MATCH. The PAYLOAD SPECIALIST stationed in the OUTPOST must remain in the OUTPOST seat during the entire MATCH (note that if the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST in the OUTPOST unbuckles the seat belt or stands up in this location, it may be considered a violation of <S01>). Each violation (stepping outside the designated area, or stepping across the PLAYERS LINE) will result in a PENALTY. Exceptions will be made in cases involving TEAM member safety.

My understanding: Payload Specialists can't move around to get a better shot.


I think that the focus needs to be on the robot getting the ball in, not on the human.

Anyone read the rules differently than I did?

[lingomaniac88]

Keep in mind that the game pieces can bounce off the poles on the trailer (both the ones around the perimeter and the one supporting the vision target). I think the payload specialists can score a lot of points if they're skilled enough.

[RossC]

I really like the idea of a turret. Being a second year team we decided to go simple and we're currently working on a basket design. I dont really like it because it was mostly done by a parent/mentor. It could also me by ego A camera guided turret has a lot of advantages. I was wondering, why does the turret have to be refilled from the top? I was thinking that a vertical lift could be built to capture balls and lift them to a point. The turret could be suspended on the lazy susan? And powered by a motor. It wouldnt allow 360 movement but you could conceivably get 270. This would allow for 180 directly in front and straight back in order to ballance the score if necessary. I dont really know if this is a good idea but I wonder what others think. If things go drastically wrong we might reconsider.

[RyanCahoon]

Originally Posted by manderson5192

I had envisioned a tube or suction cup of sorts that would need to be pointed at the floor with a rubber shroud going around the edges that would just barely clear the ground. Here are my concerns though: 1) How do I make sure the shroud doesn't touch the ground, thereby violating <R06>, and 2) Will this even work to a good extent? Will there be too great of a loss of vacuum?

Thought I'd contribute something back to the general knowledge pool:

My team prototyped a "ground sucker" today by attaching not 1, but 3 shop vac's to a rubbermaid storage container, inverted so the open side is pressed against the floor. When the container was flush against the floor, the vacuums had no problem completely collapsing it. At noticeably less than 1/16" above the floor, we felt some force, but anything above this there was no significant force. Not to say that this isn't possible, but as was pointed out earlier, 1771's success last year was largely due to getting a good seal on the ball. Our findings suggest that for this to work this year, a team would have to manufacture with very close tolerances, and any kind of flexing in the frame would cause the vacuum chamber to touch the floor; as such a robot such as this might not make it past inspection.

Has anyone else found different results?

--Ryan

[Ryan Albright]

I been reading this thread and drawing up a few designs, I still think a cannon is not going to be accurate enough.

I been looking at drawing a cannon design were it can hold at least 6 moon rocks. So after you have that loaded you have to hunt down a moving robot to score your points

I think the safest bet is to have a robot that can plow your balls to the human player so he can then shoot to score. This way the human player can adapt to how the other team is playing. I just have a feeling that a human player will be able to get more shots off then a cannon can.

I also think a hopper robot would be great, but then you are filling your hopper and hoping when you go to unload it that you can get them all in at one shot and if you miss, you just wasted all that time

I am sure I will see a couple teams design an awesome cannon that will make me eat my words. I do have to say my favorite robots each year are the ones that makes the hardest task look easy.

[XXShadowXX]

has anyone consider if the ball's recoil cause the robot to move?

[wkaeboarderNH]

our team just made a trailer to practice shooting. And its really isn't that hard, I'm terrible at basket ball but i made a good 80% on a stationary trailer. maybe a 60% on a moving one. not as hard as you may think. But the outpost with the seat may be difficult due to the hole in the wall.

[Dillon Carey]

How far away were you shooting from? were you shooting over the alliance station wall? did you count the robot being bigger then the trailer and getting in the way? and did you count the 5 other robots on the field to get in the way?

[wkaeboarderNH]

we had our mentor who is about 6 foot 5 stand with a noodle and we shot over the noodle. But no we didn't account of the robot being taller than the trailer. and not with 5 other robots. i think we were shooting from about 15 - 20 feet away.

[Robert Cawthon]

[quote=Petey;792201]My $.02? You will see almost no successful launchers this year. A few teams will pull it off, and we will marvel at them and slap our forheads and say OF COURSE, ...QUOTE]

After three years of helping design robots, I am a charter member of the "Flat Forehead Disease" club, where I see how some other team has done something, slap my forhead, and say "Why didn't I think of that!" One things for sure. Someone will come up with a neat, simple way to shoot the balls. Just hope it will be my team. Good luck, everyone. Enjoy the build.

[Robert Cawthon]

Originally Posted by XXShadowXX

This a great point. I would like to remind people that military could hit targets 23 miles away with there battleships in the 1940's using vacuum tubes, and punch cards we have 400Mhz processor, and a color camera...



So make your math to account for it.

And six weeks.

[shannieliz]

in my opinion, i think not to do it.
i mean, if you throw the ball, and it goes over the wall, it counts as a penalty.
so if you throw the ball at someone's trailer, and they are near the wall, and they move, it could go over the wall and then you would get a penalty.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by shannieliz

in my opinion, i think not to do it.
i mean, if you throw the ball, and it goes over the wall, it counts as a penalty.
so if you throw the ball at someone's trailer, and they are near the wall, and they move, it could go over the wall and then you would get a penalty.

Not necessarily. I see no rule against throwing things off the field. HOWEVER, under <S01>, you could be dealt with for doing it too often.

Also, the balls will be returned to the field in the appropriate place.