Q: How many balls can HP throw at once???

[rulesguy09]

This may have been answered before... My apologies if it has but if someone wouldn't mind answering it again:

Can the HP throw more than one ball at once? i.e. having one or two balls in each hand and launching them together?

[Koko Ed]

What is the wisdom of indiscriminately hurling balls left and right like a madman? Those balls can be counted against your alliance partners and yourself if they go in. Wouldn't it be wiser to AIM and shoot them one at a time instead? Faster does not always equate to better.

[lukevanoort]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

What is the wisdom of indiscriminately hurling balls left and right like a madman? Those balls can be counted against your alliance partners and yourself if they go in. Wouldn't it be wiser to AIM and shoot them one at a time instead? Faster does not always equate to better.

At the very start of the game, when a trailer is right in from of the human player, it would be useful to throw two at once, and I imagine the human player could, with practice, maintain accuracy when only shooting a couple feet. At other times, I agree accuracy > speed.

[mateus]

And what if a team have a great "orbit ball sucker" and a good shooter??There are many things to consider, but I think that in this case it could be good if the HP could throw quickly as many balls as possible....

[thefro526]

I don't see why a Human Player couldn't throw more than one ball at a time. If anything you may want to pick two balls up and hold one in each hand but throw them both with your dominant hand. I'm thinking that the HP is going to be picking balls up one by one in most cases so you're going to throw a ball and then use the same amount of time to pick up another one. Maybe this year the coach or the drive will be able to hand balls to the HP like in '06 (or at least I think you could do that in '06).

Some one should ask in Q&A if the Coach or a Driver can hand balls to the Human Player.

[aaeamdar]

As clearly outlined in the rules (highlighted in a recent update) nobody but the Human Players (or Payload Specialists, as they are called this year) can touch the game objects (moon rocks, empty cells, super cells).

I'm a little confused as to the responses in this thread - it seems the OP was asking "is it legal to do X" not "is it physically possible/adviseable to do X". Obviously it is physically possible for a non-physically impaired highschool student of moderate coordination to hold one ball in each hand and throw both balls - accuracy is a seperate question.

To directly answer my interpretation of the OP's original question: as far as I know (and I have read all the rules several times) there is no rule limiting the number of game pieces that the Payload Specialist can hold at a given time. Unfortunately, it's impossible/difficult to prove a negative (i.e. "there is no such rule..."), so I could be wrong. If someone can find such a rule, I will gladly retract my statement.

-Paul

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by thefro526

Some one should ask in Q&A if the Coach or a Driver can hand balls to the Human Player.

I see no need for the Q&A here, this one is pretty cut and dry.

Originally Posted by <G40>

<G40>
GAME PIECE Interaction – With the exception of PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS, no TEAM member may manipulate GAME PIECES at any time during the MATCH. Violations will result in a PENALTY.
A. At the start of the MATCH, the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST shall not be in possession of any GAME PIECE. Violations will result in a PENALTY.
B. At any time after the start of the MATCH, a PAYLOAD SPECIALIST may enter a GAME PIECE into play (e.g. launch a MOON ROCK into the CRATER or pass an EMPTY CELL through the port in the OUTPOST shield to a ROBOT).
C. PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS retrieving GAME PIECES passed from the CRATER through the AIRLOCK / FUELING PORT must use the provided tongs to pick up the GAME PIECE from the floor. Failure to do so will cause a PENALTY to be assessed.
D. The PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS is permitted to reach through the FUELING PORT with the provided tongs to manipulate GAME PIECES in the “dead space” between the AIRLOCK and the FUELING PORT. However, any contact with a ROBOT while doing so will be considered a violation of Rule <S02>.

Emphasis is mine

[rulesguy09]

Originally Posted by aaeamdar

To directly answer my interpretation of the OP's original question: as far as I know (and I have read all the rules several times) there is no rule limiting the number of game pieces that the Payload Specialist can hold at a given time. Unfortunately, it's impossible/difficult to prove a negative (i.e. "there is no such rule..."), so I could be wrong. If someone can find such a rule, I will gladly retract my statement.

-Paul

Thank you, Paul. Yes, that was my question. Strategy is one thing, and obviously it's better in most cases to throw one well-aimed ball as opposed to two or three poorly-aimed balls. But in the beginning, as lukevanoort said, releasing a volley of Moon Rocks before the opponent's trailer can get out of range might just work.

But as for the legality of doing that, I guess the absence of an explicit prohibition will have to do. I haven't been able to find any implied prohibition, either.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by aaeamdar

Unfortunately, it's impossible/difficult to prove a negative (i.e. "there is no such rule..."),

In a case like this, where there are a finite number of rules, and they are all published, you can indeed prove a negative.

[rotolomi]

i don't think there is a rule against throwing more than one ball at once, but i agree with everyone else. one ball at a time will probably insure the most accuracy and the best use of your moon rocks. if moon rocks are thrown randomly all over the field, the human player's supply will dwindle very quickly.

[ScottOliveira]

<G40>
GAME PIECE Interaction – With the exception of PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS, no TEAM member may manipulate GAME PIECES at any time during the MATCH. Violations will result in a PENALTY.
A. At the start of the MATCH, the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST shall not be in possession of any GAME PIECE. Violations will result in a PENALTY.
B. At any time after the start of the MATCH, a PAYLOAD SPECIALIST may enter a GAME PIECE into play (e.g. launch a MOON ROCK into the CRATER or pass an EMPTY CELL through the port in the OUTPOST shield to a ROBOT).
C. PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS retrieving GAME PIECES passed from the CRATER through the AIRLOCK / FUELING PORT must use the provided tongs to pick up the GAME PIECE from the floor. Failure to do so will cause a PENALTY to be assessed.
D. The PAYLOAD SPECIALISTS is permitted to reach through the FUELING PORT with the provided tongs to manipulate GAME PIECES in the “dead space” between the AIRLOCK and the FUELING PORT. However, any contact with a ROBOT while doing so will be considered a violation of Rule <S02>.

Emphasis mine.

Perhaps lawyering the rules, but it does specify "a GAME PIECE". I believe the intent would be it is acceptable to throw multiple pieces, but it isn't necessarily so 'cut and dry'. It might also be worth having them specify whether multiple different types of game pieces can be thrown at the same time, e.g. a super cell and a moon rock.

I think that there are definitely situations where it could be better to throw multiple balls. The very beginning of the match could be one, as well as the very end. If there is only a second or two left and the payload specialist finds they have 2+ balls remaining, being able to 'shotgun' a robot isn't a bad idea. (Although care would certainly need to be taken that the balls don't get into a friendly trailer).

[M. Gildner]

A good strategy for more than one ball at a time would be an HP shotgun when an opponents robot is close range

[Laaba 80]

I think I remember reading a PS can only hold one empty cell at a time, but I may be thinking that because a robot can only have 1 at a time. Anyone else remember this, or did I get confused.
I also did not see a rule prohibiting the throwing of multiple balls. It is my feeling that if something is not disallowed, than it is allowed. That is how it works in FLL, and I know they are 2 different things, but I feel the same applies to the FRC manual.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Laaba 80

I think I remember reading a PS can only hold one empty cell at a time, but I may be thinking that because a robot can only have 1 at a time. Anyone else remember this, or did I get confused.
I also did not see a rule prohibiting the throwing of multiple balls. It is my feeling that if something is not disallowed, than it is allowed. That is how it works in FLL, and I know they are 2 different things, but I feel the same applies to the FRC manual.

You're thinking robot.

I see no rules regarding how many can be handled by the PS at a time, therefore I can reasonably assume that the GDC's response if asked would be, "There are no rules governing this."

[Laaba 80]

Originally Posted by EricH

You're thinking robot.

I see no rules regarding how many can be handled by the PS at a time, therefore I can reasonably assume that the GDC's response if asked would be, "There are no rules governing this."

Yeah, I thought thats what I did. I thought I saw something about it the first time I read it, but never saw it again. Thanks.