2 sets of bumpers legal?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by A Bear

but i thought bumpers dont coult for the weight....

They don't. They have their own weight limit of 18 lbs. The question is whether <R13> applies only to the robot or applies to the robot and the bumpers independently.

Of course, then there was one team with two sets of bumpers who didn't pass inspection last year... but they had other issues with inspection.

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by EricH

Of course, then there was one team with two sets of bumpers who didn't pass inspection last year... but they had other issues with inspection.

If you're referencing 1519, that's a completely different issue. Let's try and keep that issue apart from this one to avoid confusion.

[wo-bot 141]

I have seen teams in the past switch out bumpers. for example... wildstang switched bumpers in the elimination rounds in 2006 if I recall. all i think you would have to do is weigh them both so the are both legal. Still i would got to Q&A to be sure. but like i said you should be fine.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by wo-bot 141

I have seen teams in the past switch out bumpers. for example... wildstang switched bumpers in the elimination rounds in 2006 if I recall. all i think you would have to do is weigh them both so the are both legal. Still i would got to Q&A to be sure. but like i said you should be fine.

In 2006, bumpers weren't required. They could have run without them if they wanted. Still, Q&A.

[wo-bot 141]

Originally Posted by EricH

In 2006, bumpers weren't required. They could have run without them if they wanted. Still, Q&A.

Right they were not. we didn't like the idea of bumpers so our team decide not to put the on so we could have more kinetic energy with the robot.

[Jared Russell]

Provided the other set of bumpers was functionally identical (and I would argue that color has nothing to do with function when it comes to bumpers), I believe that these would be spare parts and so unrestricted.

But what I say means nothing...ask the Q&A.

[Jimmy Nichols]

We were one of those teams over the last two compeition seasons (Rack-n-Roll and FIRST Overdrive) that had color changing bumpers. In both instances they were legal as long as each set was built to spec. But, with the all of the bumper issues this year, I would definantly check with Q&A.

We decided against this year because our graphics team wanted to make sure the bumpers fit into the color theme of the robot graphics, website, buttons, etc.

[Al Skierkiewicz]

As you are only using one set of bumpers at a time, there is no effect on overall robot weight during a match. I would expect the Q&A to agree that this is legal. However, each set of bumpers will still need to be inspected and weighed separately. Please check in with your lead inspector for the latest if the Q&A is not answered. If you showed me two different designs for the bumpers, i.e. they are not identical in form, function and weight, I would ask you to choose one.

[ChuckDickerson]

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz

As you are only using one set of bumpers at a time, there is no effect on overall robot weight during a match. I would expect the Q&A to agree that this is legal. However, each set of bumpers will still need to be inspected and weighed separately. Please check in with your lead inspector for the latest if the Q&A is not answered. If you showed me two different designs for the bumpers, i.e. they are not identical in form, function and weight, I would ask you to choose one.

Thanks for the info Al. Your logic seems reasonable and would be what I was thinking when I told the team to build two sets. As an inspector how exact would you feel the weights of the two sets must be? Other than color the two sets were made as exactly the same as we could make them. Same lengths, materials, bolts arrangement, etc. but one set weighed 0.1 lb more than the other. I assume this may just be the accuracy of our scale or the variance in the density of the plywood on one set or the other or the number of staples, etc. Is 0.1 lb nit-picking or should we worry? I'm not asking for an official ruling just as a previous inspector would you accept or reject the second set that was 0.1 lb different if the offical Q&A comes back as you have stated above?

[Al Skierkiewicz]

0.1 lb seems kind of trivial as a difference. Humidity could make that much change if you were near 18 lbs. What I would be looking for was one set over 18 and the other set under 18. I could not allow either to be over 18 for obvious reasons. An inspector has to know why the difference. Simply having two colors of the same bumper should not make a difference. I know of many teams that have two sets, one for qualifying and one for elims.

[ChuckDickerson]

Thanks Al.

[suj]

well i doubt it there doesn't seem to be a reason for it to be illegal it's like making a quick change before competition what's wrong with before matches it's not like we're swapping parts up for something illegal and ridiculous like a handsaw or rockets

[ChuckDickerson]

The Q&A had been answered and some of the answers are somewhat surprising to me: http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread.php?t=12125

If your team is planning to match your bumper colors to the alliance/trailer color then you better read this Q&A.

As for our team all of the bumpers shipped in the crate so there won't be any withholding issues. We will have to mix up the bumpers like red on the front and back and blue on the sides or something and keep the others for spares/replacements.

Glad I brought this up though. I'm still not clear why it is a tactical advantage to match your bumper color to the alliance color. Seems like it is in full view of both alliances so it wouldn't favor just our team or alliance. The GDC has spoken, we have listened and will follow their ruling.

[Molten]

Originally Posted by DeepWater

The GDC has spoken, we have listened and will follow their ruling.

I really wish all teams would follow this mind set. It would make things so much easier.

[DonRotolo]

Originally Posted by Molten

I really wish all teams would follow this mind set. It would make things so much easier.

Ah, but sometimes it is a valuable lesson when one chooses to "Challenge Authority".

(But, agreed, not in this specific instance)