Suggested Cameras for 2010 Chairman's Award Video Requirement

[artdutra04]

From the latest Bill's Blog post, with the highlight mine:

The Chairman’s Award criteria will be posted on our website as soon as the final details are decided. (I know it’s late, but I’d rather wait and post it when it’s complete.) If you’re itching to get started you should know that this year, submissions will have to include a video. Paul Lazarus of White Dwarf Productions has posted two very helpful videos here www.youtube.com/whitedwarfprods to get you going.

Even though we don't have specs for required video yet, it's likely it will be at least standard definition widescreen, possibly going to high definition in a few years. So our team, as may others I imagine, will be looking for cameras in the near future, as right now we rely on video cameras owned by team members/mentors/parents.

We'd like the following specs:

• Must shoot in HD 1080p at 30 fps
• Must record full HD video onto either 64 Gb (or higher) internal SSD OR SDHC card slot capable of supporting 16Gb/32Gb SDHC cards (internal drive size/format not important for latter option).
• Must allow for external microphones for interviews
• Must have a minimum of 10x optical zoom (for competition match video)
• Must be Mac & Final Cut Studio compatible
• Must be under $1500 (under $1000 strongly preferred), but "very good value" is preferred over "cheapest", unless cheapest has great value.

NOTE: These specs are not official! These are just what our team is looking for in order to own a camera which will keep up with technology for 5-10 years.

If you have any experience with cameras which meet these specs, or other similar video cameras (which may not meet these specs but would be helpful to other teams looking for video cameras), please share! Exact model numbers would be really appreciated. Thanks!

[ebarker]

Possibly the best camera for shooting:

1) under $ 1,000
2) HD
3) 16:9
4) external microphone capable !!!!!!!
5) flash memory, no disc, no tape

would be the Canon HF20 - about $900 everywhere. ( not the HF200 )

External microphone in the under $ 1,00 class of camera is almost exclusive to Canon. Plus it doesn't hurt that it is a great camera.

If your budget is unlimited go for the Panasonic AG-HMC150, about $ 5,000 with accessories. That gets you broadcast grade HD with a tapeless workflow straight into an NLE.

[ATannahill]

Chairman's criteria is listed at http://www.usfirst.org/community/frc...nt.aspx?id=440, stated one blog post later that the one you referenced.

[waialua359]

Competing for the World Chairman's Award just got that much tougher!
We all knew that it would come to this. I cant see it impacting regionals as much as those that compete at the CMP level. I'd put money that the difference in how judges decide between 2 similar teams will be that video, if not now, in the near near future!

As I watched the 236 video last year at CMP, that had to have been professionally made, or it was some exceptional video making by an exceptional bunch of students. Props to them!

[ebarker]

Originally Posted by waialua359

As I watched the 234 video last year at CMP, that had to have been professionally made, or it was some exceptional video making by an exceptional bunch of students. Props to them!

It was well made but it isn't that hard to do if you focus on the basics and do not try to do advanced techniques. For example pan and zoom is an advanced technique that is highly abused by amateurs. So don't do it.

Learn the basics - here is a good tutorial

And a CD thread here

[Akash Rastogi]

First thing I'd ask teams to do is ask their school news station club/class about loaning a camera for a while. Those kids are surprisingly helpful. It also helps to have those kids as part of your team so that they get more robotics stuff on the morning announcements like we did. Just food for thought.

Originally Posted by waialua359

As I watched the 234 video last year at CMP, that had to have been professionally made, or it was some exceptional video making by an exceptional bunch of students. Props to them!

Where can i find said video?

[waialua359]

Our school and subteam has a Digital Media Center, however, I think having the advice/expertise to help create the video is essential.

Creating a video is more than just a simple set of techniques of shooting. The storyboard, sounds, and how the video clips all gel together to send the right message is not easy to do.
We've all seen good and bad movies at the theatre, but wasn't the quality all in HD? Its those other intangibles that take a lot of hard work and effort, especially when you only have a few minutes to get your point across.

As I mentioned before, you need some exceptional outstanding stuff if your going to have your video shown at CMP.
And team 236 certainly had it, which complemented the kind of program they've been running for a long time now.

[Pjohn1959]

Originally Posted by ebarker

Possibly the best camera for shooting:

would be the Canon HF20 - about $900 everywhere. ( not the HF200 )

Absolutely agree. Just bought one a couple of weeks ago to use on this very project. Got it online for $700. Wonderful camera with all the bells and whistles that you would need. Small and easy to use.

Paul

[ebarker]

Originally Posted by Pjohn1959

Absolutely agree. Just bought one a couple of weeks ago to use on this very project. Got it online for $700. Wonderful camera with all the bells and whistles that you would need. Small and easy to use.

Paul

Product updates:

In the under $ 900 range - Canon HF20

In the 'broadcast quality' range the Panasonic AG-HMC40 is from the professional side of Panasonic and represents a stunning level of performance versus price. under $ 2,000, Panasonic dropped the price and is getting aggressive.

[MissDaisyGirl]

Our team recently invested in a Canon HV30. Its predecessor, the HV20 had been touted as one of the best cameras around for "second camera" status on some TV shows. The HV30 follows up with a few tweaks but is basically the same.

I know that you're not looking for a tape-based camera (this uses MiniDV) and I mulled over the same decision when I went to buy my own HV30 a few months before the team. Ultimately I came to this decision because of a few reasons but mainly because cameras that record onto harddrives or cards often compress their video which leads to lower quality. If you plan to do any good keying from a green/blue screen its recommended you start out with video that's as "pure" as possible. Due to this fact alone I decided against harddrive/card systems.

In addition, a student on our team had a Canon harddrive camera last year and it took many painstaking hours to get her horribly encoded file format into a format that Final Cut Pro would understand. If you do go for one of these cameras be *absolutely certain* that FCP will accept the file format. If not, you're going to be scouring the web for free conversion programs PC or Mac, trying everything under the sun for hours at a time to get it to work. Ultimately, its not worth it. Tape cameras hook up to your Mac and they work. Period.

The HV30 also shoots in 24p, 30p, and 60i. Its not HD though, its HDV so be aware you'll pay $$$ for full HD. It has an external audio jack with onboard audio leveling controls with the touch of a joystick. It also has manual focus controls (for those ever important rack focus shots), manual white balance, etc. Overall, a good buy for ~$800!

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-VIXIA-HV...23498&sr =8-2

[artdutra04]

Thank you Black Friday!

Best Buy has the Canon HF20 for $499, and when we arrived at 7am, they still had one in stock!

I bought a Canon HV40 last week and as luck would have it my professional camera, my XDCAM PDW-330 was in the shop for an estimate on some repair and I used the HV40 which is like an HV30 except for one or two things and I used it on a few shoots for both of the Toronto area TV stations I shoot for and I actually got compliments, I don't get a compliment all year with my big camera and I use this little camera and I get not one but two compliments.

I'm very happy with it, it replaces my 12 year old Panasonic mini-dv that I use as an emergency back up camera or dash-cam in storms etc or for being more discrete as in news sometimes you need to be not to visible.

very happy with it so far.

m
\

Originally Posted by MissDaisyGirl

Our team recently invested in a Canon HV30. Its predecessor, the HV20 had been touted as one of the best cameras around for "second camera" status on some TV shows. The HV30 follows up with a few tweaks but is basically the same.

I know that you're not looking for a tape-based camera (this uses MiniDV) and I mulled over the same decision when I went to buy my own HV30 a few months before the team. Ultimately I came to this decision because of a few reasons but mainly because cameras that record onto harddrives or cards often compress their video which leads to lower quality. If you plan to do any good keying from a green/blue screen its recommended you start out with video that's as "pure" as possible. Due to this fact alone I decided against harddrive/card systems.

In addition, a student on our team had a Canon harddrive camera last year and it took many painstaking hours to get her horribly encoded file format into a format that Final Cut Pro would understand. If you do go for one of these cameras be *absolutely certain* that FCP will accept the file format. If not, you're going to be scouring the web for free conversion programs PC or Mac, trying everything under the sun for hours at a time to get it to work. Ultimately, its not worth it. Tape cameras hook up to your Mac and they work. Period.

The HV30 also shoots in 24p, 30p, and 60i. Its not HD though, its HDV so be aware you'll pay $$$ for full HD. It has an external audio jack with onboard audio leveling controls with the touch of a joystick. It also has manual focus controls (for those ever important rack focus shots), manual white balance, etc. Overall, a good buy for ~$800!

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-VIXIA-HV...23498&sr =8-2

[MissDaisyGirl]

Awesome to see another happy Canon HV## customer! It is a great little camera in my opinion.

Originally Posted by Mark Rozitis

I bought a Canon HV40 last week and as luck would have it my professional camera, my XDCAM PDW-330 was in the shop for an estimate on some repair and I used the HV40 which is like an HV30 except for one or two things and I used it on a few shoots for both of the Toronto area TV stations I shoot for and I actually got compliments, I don't get a compliment all year with my big camera and I use this little camera and I get not one but two compliments.

I'm very happy with it, it replaces my 12 year old Panasonic mini-dv that I use as an emergency back up camera or dash-cam in storms etc or for being more discrete as in news sometimes you need to be not to visible.

very happy with it so far.

m
\

[waialua359]

We finally bought a couple of Sony PD170's to complement our little handheld HD ones and have been using it for a couple of months now filming events and pre-construction. Only drawback is the HDV tapes are very pricey. We pay about $20.00/85 minute tape.

[TEntwistle]

Originally Posted by waialua359

As I watched the 236 video last year at CMP, that had to have been professionally made, or it was some exceptional video making by an exceptional bunch of students. Props to them!

They did have an excellent video, and the website notes help of a local anchorman. Given the competition for Chairman's awards, it seems like a good idea to partner with a local expert in making the video. Not only will it be better quality, but it will probably be a better experience for the students involved.

Someone asked about the video from 236. The link to it is:

http://sites.team236.org/2009/chairman-s-award