New Game Criticism

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

Lots to like (imho)

• Easily the most causal viewer friendly game we've had in years (perhaps ever).
• Can explain the game to Grandma in 10 seconds
• Favors scoring
• No descoring
• 2 places to score and only 1 robot to defend
• No messing if they tip over
• No messing with robots when trying to elevate or suspend
• should be many exciting finishes

Of course, there are things that I am less happy about (may degrade into a penalty fest if teams are stupid) but nothing I can see that is a deal breaker.

I suspect that by the end of the season it will be considered one of the best games FIRST has had in the 1st 20 years.

Joe J.

Unfortunately alot of teams like to take the stupid route instead instead of actually reading the rules and using strategy.

[RyanN]

I generally like the game. It's the best since 2007.

I like how it keeps the familiarity with a game such as soccer. It also gives rookie teams or teams without much machining ability to perform very well.

Some of the rules need some specification. One that stands out is G29. Not descriptive, and seems really harsh if a robot becomes disabled (such as flipped) on the opposing side.

I do like the bonus. It adds pressure to all teams to think of certain ways to grab one another and how to create a strong enough connection to withstand the weight of multiple robots. The bonus can be worth anything from 2 to 8 points from my understanding (2 points for just one robot, 8 points for one robot (2pts), then 2 robots attached to the one hanging (6pts). It adds a lot of points if the teams can work together.

One last thought. I really do like the ramps though. Just a personal favor.

[BenX02]

Overall, I like it. I do have a few issues with it though.

First of all, you are pretty limited to what you can do with the robot, in terms of design. It pretty much makes no sense to make a robot higher then 16"-17". I'm also not a fan of how the ball can't be more then 3" inside your frame.

Plus I'm not sure if I understand the whole seeding thing.

But overall I like it, and it should be a lot of fun as a driver.

[Travis Hoffman]

Originally Posted by LavastormSW

I agree. I think a lot of the rookie teams won't try to make an autonomous program, seeing as there's no bonus. Hopefully they do anyways, though.

Failure to move the 3 balls out of the far zone in autonomous leaves those 3 balls right next to the opponent's scoring goals. Seems like incentive enough to me.

[Tetraman]

I usually hate FIRST games right off the bat, to this I will be honest. (go back to all my treads and see the kind of gripes I've made) And yes, I had a bunch of problems with this game once I saw it.

However, after talking about it with a few people and reading over some of the very complicated rules, I am rapidly warming up to this game. I really like it. And the thing I love the most: Scores are in increments of 1. It's about time we get simple scoring methods in these games.

And really, the things I dislike this year, are rather petty. I can claim that there won't be much innovation done as all robots effectively need to be are boxes, but I thought of a few interesting ideas once I put those thoughts aside.

Originally Posted by Joe Johnson

I suspect that by the end of the season it will be considered one of the best games FIRST has had in the 1st 20 years.

I'm going to have to agree. This game has the potential to be as exciting as Aim High.

[GGCO]

Definitely spectator friendly. It's going to be intense when robots fight for balls in the middle, and when robots try to block other bots.

And I'm looking forward to seeing robots that steal balls from other robots. Almost like Lunacy, that was crazy fun. This time, spectators will actually be able to understand it.

I don't know if there is much of an advantage to climb the tower though...

[Cyberphil]

Hey guys,

Im posting on here because it is called game criticism, but this is more of a criticism of the amount of info on the game and materials. Please check this thread and see if you can answer the question:


http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...threadid=79754

I am very sorry that this does not have to do with the subject, but it is important. I appreciate it very much!

Thanks,
Phil

[Radical Pi]

Originally Posted by GGCO

I don't know if there is much of an advantage to climb the tower though...

If you get a bot hanging off another bot, that's 5 points. A 3rd one hanging on the 1st brings it to 8 points. Considering each penalty is only 1 point, 8 points must make a huge difference

[Cyberphil]

Originally Posted by Radical Pi

If you get a bot hanging off another bot, that's 5 points. A 3rd one hanging on the 1st brings it to 8 points. Considering each penalty is only 1 point, 8 points must make a huge difference

But think about that. The top robot has to hold all three robots up. That's 360lbs. Quite a bit of weight!

[ICntIHaveRbtics]

Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman

Failure to move the 3 balls out of the far zone in autonomous leaves those 3 balls right next to the opponent's scoring goals. Seems like incentive enough to me.

Agreed. People are going to definitely want to get the balls back into their own turf as quickly as possible. I feel like though once they score and start rolling back into the middle of the field though, there's going to be some duking it out between robots going on in the center, thus making this game exciting!

[TD912]

Originally Posted by BenX02

I'm also not a fan of how the ball can't be more then 3" inside your frame.

In a way, the rules are somewhat like actual soccer. You don't 'carry' or 'hold' the ball, just mainly kick it in front of you.

The only thing that seems sorta iffy is the autonomous, like what others have mentioned. However, remember that none of the other opposing robots will be defending the goal, meaning that if you manage to score all 6 balls into the goal, you get 1 more point than a robot hanging from a robot hanging from the tower!

[bizarro2346]

All in all, I like the game. It's considerably more simple than Lunacy, and the scores are all added (that is, there are no confusing, game changing multipliers). I also like how there is less emphasis on the human players this time around, so the focus is more on the bots.

The one thing I'm wary of is the Tower-climbing part. It seems like it would be a little difficult to develop a method of effectively climbing/hanging from it.

[DanDon]

Originally Posted by Cyberphil

But think about that. The top robot has to hold all three robots up. That's 360lbs. Quite a bit of weight!

Phil....the way I see it, it's more like a max of 450 rather than 360 (120*3 [robot] + 15*13 [bumpers] + 15*3 [battery]).

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by DanDon

Phil....the way I see it, it's more like a max of 450 rather than 360 (120*3 [robot] + 15*13 [bumpers] + 15*3 [battery]).

What if one robot sits on the palfrom while the other two sit on top of it? Will that be 2 or 3 points for each bot?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

What if one robot sits on the palfrom while the other two sit on top of it? Will that be 2 or 3 points for each bot?

Assuming no tower contact by the 2 on top, 8 points (2 for the one on the platform, 3 each for the other two), according to <G04-B> and the definition of suspended.