Soccer Ball Sold Out

[BrendanB]

Originally Posted by Brandon Holley

Guys, I'm right there with you in agreement with FIRST keeping their games under wraps. They absolutely need to take into account the secrecy of the game. That being said, I feel this is an issue that can be handled rather simply when communicating with a company. It is a large commitment (think about the amount of FRC teams that need soccer balls now). Why should I have to design my robot to work with a bunch of different balls when I know exactly which one will be used in competition? It seems to me like this is a problem that can be handled better.

Brandon, I completely agree with you, FIRST needs to tell suppliers in advance that a large order will becoming in along with a large demand come the beginning of the year. Its not fair to the teams or the company who is being left in the dark.

Also, being engineers, the game design commitee probably overlooked the fact that different balls perform differently when kicked and moved. I guess this will be another engineer mishap to over come like indiefan said. Let's look on the bright side though, at least soccer balls aren't sold out worldwide yet!

[MrForbes]

I wonder how inflation will vary among balls during a competition, and between competitions. And I wonder if this difference will be at least as great as the differences between different brand/models of balls.

Perhaps the sky isn't falling? I guess we'll find out when teams post videos showing their magic device handling and shooting different balls, and spec balls at different inflation.

[IndySam]

I absolutely agree that FIRST has made a mistake of not providing each team a ball in the KOP and choosing such a limited availability ball.


Having said that I will also say that if you spend too much time building your design to an exact type and size of ball you will be doing your team a great disservice. FIRST teams are hard on game elements and reset crews don't have the time to spend checking inflation levels of balls. You need to design your mechanism to work with balls that are in many conditions because that's what you will be dealing with on the field, especially in later regionals.

[rfolea]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

I'll begin this with my standard preface that

BUT... if it is indeed the case that the soccer balls are now sold out, this is entirely inexcusable. Last year... the first time... was a forgivable mistake. But to source game pieces made of unobtainium for two years in a row is unacceptable.

Jason

"Well hopefully we will see two things out of this:
1) a lesson learned for distribution"

Why does everyone refer to last year as "the First Time?" Does no one remember the poof ball fiasco - that company was totally blind sided. Said they could have easily been prepared if someone had just mentioned it was coming ...

Stupid Question - I can't find the spec's for the ball in the documentation - can someone point me towards it? Is it the HS300 everyone is referring to?

[MrForbes]

As usual, game piece specs are in Section 6 of the manual (ARENA)

[dtengineering]

Okay... just spoke to a DTI rep by phone. They called, based on my (now authenticated as non-spam) e-mail that I mentioned in an earlier post.

They were very friendly and helpful.

They offered a soccer ball with similar stitching and surface finish to the HS300 for the same price.

They also mentioned that the HS300 does have a slightly different finish than a standard size 5 ball that you might buy "off the shelf", so I feel it is worthwhile buying a couple of close matches.

And they certainly CAN ship to Canada.

I asked if they had been expecting a rush on soccer balls... they had been told to expect an increase in orders, and thought they were prepared... but weren't.

So FIRST did make an effort to avoid this situation... just an insufficient one.

Had we received ONE ball in our KoP we could have gone to a local store, found a similar, suitable match, saved money on shipping and brokerage, and been 100% happy with the game. Instead of, like 98 or 99% happy. (Okay... I wouldn't have been 100% happy with the new qualifying algorithm, but the game does seem to be really, really good so far.)

And on a bright side of dealing with what is actually a fairly local supplier (I was IN Seattle on Saturday to pick up the KoP!), I was able to invite the DTI folks to come out to Key Arena on March 25-27 and see what all the fuss is about.

Jason

[Bob Steele]

it was great to see you here by the way!! We are looking forward to having you on the field!!

It is pretty interesting that being in Seattle and having a local supplier doesn't help much when they don't have anything to give you.

I do applaud DTI for coming up with a similar ball for the same price.
I ordered 3 of them....

when they come anyone in the area is welcome to borrow one...(with the caveat that they ARE the substitue version...and not the real thing.)
We are going to have to have a bunch more for the pre-ship on field play time...
So will be very interested to find out if anyone out there gets a real one and finds an acceptable subsitute (s) in the market place.
****************
Let's fix this.... the FIRST community just needs to work together ...
and we will adapt...we will overcome...we will improvise...
Move ahead.... use our time in a positive fashion...

Ok who is getting real game balls that can report back to us about suitable substitutes?

thanks

Good luck and see you at the competition...!!!

[Racer26]

Originally Posted by rfolea

"Well hopefully we will see two things out of this:
1) a lesson learned for distribution"

Why does everyone refer to last year as "the First Time?" Does no one remember the poof ball fiasco - that company was totally blind sided. Said they could have easily been prepared if someone had just mentioned it was coming ...

Stupid Question - I can't find the spec's for the ball in the documentation - can someone point me towards it? Is it the HS300 everyone is referring to?

Agreed. Last year was by no means the first time.

2010: DTI Soccer Balls are unobtainium, not going back into production till the competitions have started
2009: Orbit balls became unobtainium, Blip Toys wasnt going to manufacture more till after competitions started
2008: Trackballs were DIFFICULT to obtain, but were not so bad because there were so few in the game, and were expensive.
2007: The tubes were not easy to get until after the games were done.
2006: The poof ball manufacturer was blindsided, they got really hard to get
2005: Used game pieces teams could make themselves.
2004: The 5 pt balls became hard to get the exact model, luckily, lots of similar 14" rubber balls exist in high school gymnasiums
2003: The sterilite bins used were unobtainium for months after the competitions.

Thats as far back as i've been involved... FIRST game pieces becoming unobtainium by the second week of January happens regularly. FIRST needs to warn the manufacturers adequately.

[TheOtherGuy]

So perhaps teams that get the official ball early can go to several stores and provide a list of balls with similar qualities? Given this is an engineering competition, maybe the large amount of engineers/aspiring-engineers can actually solve this problem...

[David Brinza]

Maybe something has changed at DTI Sports!

Their website indicates that they are currently selling DTI HS300 Club size 5, white soccer balls, the Official Breakaway game piece!

I just ordered two. I am now 99.44% happy (I would be completely happy if we got a ball with the KOP).

[DtD]

Honestly I don't know what the fuss is about. A socer ball is a socer ball. Our team didn't even consider getting an official ball, we are going to design our robot to use the misc size 5 soccer balls we all have lying around our houses.

I can understand the issue with Lunacy, where the game pieces were very unique and diffrent some anything else.

~DtD

[Racer26]

Originally Posted by David Brinza

Maybe something has changed at DTI Sports!

Their website indicates that they are currently selling DTI HS300 Club size 5, white soccer balls, the Official Breakaway game piece!

I just ordered two. I am now 99.44% happy (I would be completely happy if we got a ball with the KOP).

Perhaps DTI woke up and said wait a minute, theres ~2000 teams who probably each want about 2 balls, we can make a lot of money here. Hey boys, put those balls back into production NOW.

[BrendanB]

Originally Posted by 1075guy

Perhaps DTI woke up and said wait a minute, theres ~2000 teams who probably each want about 2 balls, we can make a lot of money here. Hey boys, put those balls back into production NOW.

Most likely because now in the product details section they mention that it is the official game piece of the 2010 robotics competition Breakaway.

Thank you DTI for helping out in the ways you can at the moment, it is appreciated!

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by 1075guy

Perhaps DTI woke up and said wait a minute, theres ~2000 teams who probably each want about 2 balls, we can make a lot of money here. Hey boys, put those balls back into production NOW.

Or maybe they have an inventory/ordering system that is not particularly robust and anyone ordering one of these balls will be getting a phone call about a back order.

[Jared Russell]

LOL, when you add one of the balls to your cart, under "Stock" it has the infinity sign.

Maybe they aren't unobtainium after all?