Solenoid is teh fail

[Nick Seidl]

We are using the 2010 Festo solenoid valve. We've double/triple checked the wiring, and yes, we got the memo about it being 24v. The plumbing has also been checked. At this point, we only get the light on the valve to blink when fire the cylinder. A clicking noise also occurs. Yet, no air is redirected. We suspect that the solenoid is DOA (as per what has been noted about these solenoids in other threads). Before we mess with trying to replace it, any other ideas on how to make this thing behave itself?

[DonRotolo]

Are you firing it with air pressure? Make sure it's about 20 PSI or more.

Can you switch it manually? Those little blue buttons do that.

I trust that the plumbing is correct, and the exhaust hole doesn't have a plug in it. One guaranteed way to eliminate this possibility is to remove ALL the lines/connectors/plugs except the air input, then try it.

It is possible you got a bad one, but they are awfully reliable and rarely fail like that.

Got a photo of the plumbing and a drawing of the wiring we can check? (The light coming on is a good sign, wiring is likely correct)

[ayeckley]

Originally Posted by Don Rotolo

It is possible you got a bad one, but they are awfully reliable and rarely fail like that.

The "old" style FESTO valves used in 2009 and earlier did appear to have significant reliability issues. In most cases, the descriptions of the failures exactly matched the mode described above. This is the first evidence I've seen of any issue with the "new" style FESTO valves (which more closely resemble the SMC design, at least outwardly). Please report back and let us know if insufficient pilot air pressure was indeed the cause of the problem or not.

[Numbers]

Team 3238 also has a defective model. Tried hooking it to the compressor and everything.

[TD912]

Same here. Clicking sound and lights up, but no airflow. We're 99% sure everything is connected correctly, including the 12/24v issue.

Hooking up an old SMC solenoid to the same wires works.

Unless there's a simple mistake we're all making...?

[bladetech932]

make sure you are using the metal solenoid because the plastic ones break so easily,we had 4 defective ones.

[Nick Seidl]

OK, here is some more information. First, we know that we have 60psi getting to the solenoid. We also realized we did have the plumbing wrong, however fixing this did not resolve the issue. We also took last year's solenoid (which we know works), and tried that instead, and got the same result. At this point we know that its not the solenoid itself that's not behaving. We'll defenestrate our programmer, and I'll report back our solution if we get anything working.

[ayeckley]

Originally Posted by Nick Seidl

OK, here is some more information. First, we know that we have 60psi getting to the solenoid. We also realized we did have the plumbing wrong, however fixing this did not resolve the issue. We also took last year's solenoid (which we know works), and tried that instead, and got the same result. At this point we know that its not the solenoid itself that's not behaving. We'll defenestrate our programmer, and I'll report back our solution if we get anything working.

But the light on the pilot valve is blinking when you energize it, yes? Just one pilot valve at a time, or both? Should only be one...

[Mark McLeod]

Since last year's solenoid is 12v I assume for your test you changed at least the Solenoid Bumper power supply from the cRIO 24v connector to the regular red/black 12v wago connectors on the Power Distribution Panel?

Hard to do a true replacement test without another 24v solenoid.

If the programming is correct the status lights on the cRIO Solenoid Module will light up - no solenoid required for a visual check.

Originally Posted by Nick Seidl

We also took last year's solenoid (which we know works), and tried that instead, and got the same result.

[jsasaki]

Does anyonw have the link to the old smc pneumatic solenoid valves because I look and look on their site and can never find it? Oh and its legal to use those right according to this?
<R72> C. Solenoid valves. All such valves must have a maximum ⅛” NPT port diameter, and a maximum Cv of 0.32 (if non-KOP valves are used, the team will be required to provide part documentation validating that the valves meet these constraints).

[Mark McLeod]

Any of the SMC SY3000 series are under the 2010 rules Cv requirement.

Do not get the SY5000 series. They are all above the legal .32 Cv

Oddly enough the Festos are not rated in Cv, but in something like ml/s. That's not going to be documentable for an inspector.

There are some links posted in other recent solenoid treads, or I'll hunt up some soon. I've got robotics now and a wireless bridge that's DOA.

[DonRotolo]

Originally Posted by Nick Seidl

At this point we know that its not the solenoid itself that's not behaving.

Good, maybe. Again, check those things mentioned in this thread.

Originally Posted by Nick Seidl

We'll defenestrate our programmer

Throw him out the window?

[AndrewJS]

Just to clarify:

1) The old 2009 festo valve works when manually testing it. It was wired into the 12v power supply (not 24). When testing with the sample program "simple solenoid example," an orange light lit up on it, but it did not actuate. We double checked the wiring and the plumbing to no avail.
2)The 2010 valve was plugged into the 24v power supply. I was absent for most of it's testing and can't say much more.
3) Yes both had 60psi of pressure (sometimes a bit less) going to them via the regulator.

We meet tomorrow at 9am, so we'll test all other possible suggestions/options then. My guess is that it's just defective, but we'll double check as always.

[Joe Finkel]

Mark, when you mention the SMC SY3000 solenoid,you probably also meant
that it has to be 24v as well?

[efoote868]

Originally Posted by TD912

We're 99% sure everything is connected correctly, including the 12/24v issue.

A guy I work with was telling me about one of the supervisors he had many years back. He quoted him as saying - "Gene, don't give me this bull about how you're absolutely sure. You're a goddang engineer, leave yourself some wiggle room. From now on when I ask you your name, you'd better say 'I'm 95% sure it's Gene.'"

Double-Triple check everything again, have an outside person look at it, and when you're 95% sure that its all correct and it still doesn't work, try replacing it.

Chances are if the replacement doesn't work, you shouldn't have been 95% sure.
Best of luck.