Picking Two other Robots off the ground

[waialua359]

I hope I get to see this live at least once this season.

[MrFixIt2719]

YOU JUST MIGHT

[BryantWebb]

There is one component on every robot this year that you could know exactly where to grab onto. The bumpers being at a regulated height would allow a robot with a claw to grab onto one or two other robots relatively easily assuming the other robot's frame/bumpers could support the weight and your lifting mechanism was strong enough.

[EricLeifermann]

Originally Posted by jamie_1930

Then it doesn't matter for them at all, there job during competition will be to either run defense by blocking the path of the opposing alliance to their tower or to continue scoring during the finale. What I'm trying to get across is that for robots planning to hang from the bar during the finale they should try and include a way for other robots to hang from them as well, there are simple answers to the solution and if implemented effectively can help you obtain substantial points during the match.

I for one am a little weary on the idea that drivers are going to easily be able to grab onto my robot in the right place while begin many feet away and not have a clear line of sight. I don't want a driver to miss and then accidentally rip out my electronics or a piece of the robot that wasn't designed to hold 150 lbs.

So yes adding a bar is an easy solution to getting robots suspended, but you have to think about the trust you are putting into another team to not rip your robot to shreds. Not that you shouldn't trust other teams but when it comes to driving robots, as wells as driving a car in real life, i don't trust anyone to not make mistakes 100% of the time (myself included).

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by jamie_1930

Then it doesn't matter for them at all, there job during competition will be to either run defense by blocking the path of the opposing alliance to their tower or to continue scoring during the finale. What I'm trying to get across is that for robots planning to hang from the bar during the finale they should try and include a way for other robots to hang from them as well, there are simple answers to the solution and if implemented effectively can help you obtain substantial points during the match.

That's the exact opposite of what the original idea of the designs being tossed around in this thread is, though. There are multiple potential methods for lifting an entire alliance regardless of whether or not the other two members were designed to hang. If those 8 points are going to be a large part of your teams' strategy, finding a way to get robot who aren't designed to hang into a suspended position will be a big part of your design challenge.

Beyond that, simply assuming putting a bar in the air will be sufficient for another robot to hang off of you is still awfully presumptuous. You will have to factor in how another robot hanging off of yours impacts your CG (and how that impacts both robots), where that bar will be relative to the field, how to lower each robot at the end of a match, how to avoid complications due to size restraints and the finale configuration (ie, will the haning robot have to be in contact with the tower to get into their finale configuration and can they hang from you if they're contacting the tower?), how to avoid potential damage from hanging mechanisms and suspended robots, and how to elevate (and keep elevated without power) more weight. None of these are trivial questions.

[BrendanB]

I think there will be only 1 if any robots at a regional who can lift two robots, and lifting two will be the only thing they do. Lifting nearly 450lbs of robot is a LOT of weight and stress on components. It will take careful planning to coordinate such an operation and is very VERY risky.

My advice- DON'T DO IT!

Good luck!

[a kenny03]

Originally Posted by Tom Line

It isn't that simple. How are you going to lift yourself and guarantee your bot can't tip forward or back? Now you need a rigid lift mechanism cantilevered out 3 feet from the tower. That is no easy task. Now you need to make sure you can cross a bump or go under the tunnel. Again, no easy task.

I would suggest that anyone who thinks this might be an easy or simple design challenge pay close attention to the number of teams that actually manage to pull it off and do it well.

Lifting 2 robots in '07 was a far more simple task, and yet you still had a very small percentage of robots that were capable of doing it reliably.

we could do it
haha and we were reliable
only team at new jersey regional that successfully scored all 60 points.
yes, we.beast GRRRRRR!!!!!

[jamie_1930]

Originally Posted by EricLeifermann

I for one am a little weary on the idea that drivers are going to easily be able to grab onto my robot in the right place while begin many feet away and not have a clear line of sight. I don't want a driver to miss and then accidentally rip out my electronics or a piece of the robot that wasn't designed to hold 150 lbs.

So yes adding a bar is an easy solution to getting robots suspended, but you have to think about the trust you are putting into another team to not rip your robot to shreds. Not that you shouldn't trust other teams but when it comes to driving robots, as wells as driving a car in real life, i don't trust anyone to not make mistakes 100% of the time (myself included).

There is going to be a matter of trust on whether or not you are going to allow another team to use this method, but is something I think we'll be seeing this year. Also as far as the electronics go it is always a common theme for the games that you need to have a robust design, especially when it comes to electrical components, but you should have these components well protected even if you don't plan on doing this.

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

That's the exact opposite of what the original idea of the designs being tossed around in this thread is, though. There are multiple potential methods for lifting an entire alliance regardless of whether or not the other two members were designed to hang. If those 8 points are going to be a large part of your teams' strategy, finding a way to get robot who aren't designed to hang into a suspended position will be a big part of your design challenge.

Beyond that, simply assuming putting a bar in the air will be sufficient for another robot to hang off of you is still awfully presumptuous. You will have to factor in how another robot hanging off of yours impacts your CG (and how that impacts both robots), where that bar will be relative to the field, how to lower each robot at the end of a match, how to avoid complications due to size restraints and the finale configuration (ie, will the haning robot have to be in contact with the tower to get into their finale configuration and can they hang from you if they're contacting the tower?), how to avoid potential damage from hanging mechanisms and suspended robots, and how to elevate (and keep elevated without power) more weight. None of these are trivial questions.

I still think that a simple bar would be an easy solution and I think you should be able to coordinate this maneuver with little complications. Although I just went back to reread the original post and realized how far off topic I've taken this, so I'll finish here.

[MrFixIt2719]

Originally Posted by BrendanB

I think there will be only 1 if any robots at a regional who can lift two robots, and lifting two will be the only thing they do. Lifting nearly 450lbs of robot is a LOT of weight and stress on components. It will take careful planning to coordinate such an operation and is very VERY risky.

My advice- DON'T DO IT!

Good luck!

lifting 450 lbs is the easy part by using torqued down motor and pullies but making the frame strong so it won't bend is key but we have figured out a good way to overcome that so i can wait to put the bot to its final test

[Bill_B]

Those of you who may be considering lifting your two alliance partners in the finale should first answer the question: what would convince you to be a part of a double lift by another team? If you have an answer for that, then I think you just might have a solid starting point for your own design. I'd like to hear the alliance meeting at which two "lifters" are deciding which team will do the lifting. If someone makes a video of it, LMK OK?

[MrFixIt2719]

Originally Posted by Bill_B

Those of you who may be considering lifting your two alliance partners in the finale should first answer the question: what would convince you to be a part of a double lift by another team? If you have an answer for that, then I think you just might have a solid starting point for your own design. I'd like to hear the alliance meeting at which two "lifters" are deciding which team will do the lifting. If someone makes a video of it, LMK OK?

which ever team does a better job of lifting and if your both good pick one meeting spot and who ever is closer then there the lifters

[Bill_B]

Tarik,
are you supposing that you will be able (timewise or otherwise) to determine which of your qualification alliance partners is the better lifter BEFORE you have to start a match? A sort of lift-off so-to-speak? Good thing there won't be many teams who think their robot can lift two other bots and then elevate themselves. Or are there?

[MrFixIt2719]

no i am saying throught other matches you would be able to tell which is better and whichever team on the field is closer to the pre determined lifting spot is the lifter then if the better lifter isnot in place

[lenny8]

Originally Posted by Edoc'sil

Just make a pair of bars to either side that can slide underneath a robots chassis. Most bots have at least an inch of clearance off the floor if not a bit more. Drop the bars have the other bots drive on top of them and then you can haul all three up, assuming the weight is reasonably distributed.

A crude pic


I think that gets my point across? Idk if it is reasonable within the finale config but, hey.

Edit * that pic was a pain, should have done it in paint.

i came up with this and 2 other ideas but, when discussing with other mentors this idea wasn't feasible with the size restraints. also i believe you have to be on the platform anyways so, the question was how to get on the platform, let down the ramps and be able to left both sides with out droping at bot. also they didn't want someone to come and ram into the ramps while lifting. ( it would happen no matter what people say.)

my .02

[MrFixIt2719]

Lenny 8,

In first there are no limits so nothing is impossibe. all ideas can work it just depends on how much you believe in that idea and the drive to make it to prove evryone wrong