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  #151   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-02-2010, 00:19
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Great work Robowranglers. The DiscoBots are looking forward to playing 148 in Lone Star !

Quote:
Originally Posted by roboticWanderor View Post
as for the drivetrain, the pnumatics dropping down the middle "strafe wheel" as you pull up your traction wheels gives this robot some fierce adaptability. don't expect to be able to pin 148 anyway similar to lone star 2009.
yet again, the robowranglers seem to make use of almost every motor in the kit, while still maintaining an elegant design. good work.
I'm still a bit confused as what drops down and how. Do you only raise the strafe wheel when going up the ramp ? How do the traction wheels move up and down ?
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Unread 23-02-2010, 00:23
Akash Rastogi Akash Rastogi is offline
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

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Originally Posted by lynca View Post
Great work Robowranglers. The DiscoBots are looking forward to playing 148 in Lone Star !



I'm still a bit confused as what drops down and how. Do you only raise the strafe wheel when going up the ramp ? How do the traction wheels move up and down ?
If you pause the video, there seems to be a pivot in the center. I'm guessing it all actuates on one joint.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 00:36
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

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Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi View Post
If you pause the video, there seems to be a pivot in the center. I'm guessing it all actuates on one joint.
You need keen eyes to watch a Robowranglers video.

It looks more like each of four wheel pods are actuated individually by a pneumatic cylinder. See this picture, which I assume to be a Nonadrive practice chassis that was figured out sometime before build season.



Also, I scanned this years video for small hidden photos of 1114 or 217 to no avail. The build pictures do show how many crazy prototypes went into this design.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 00:42
Akash Rastogi Akash Rastogi is offline
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

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Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman View Post
Don't cry [even virtual tears!] - everything's relative. 148 maximizes the output they get from the plentiful input resources they have, including human. If the output your team generates relative to your team's available inputs is near the same ratio as theirs, be proud of that achievement, as your results are no less impressive.

Most people in FIRST do (and if they don't, should) look beyond the absolute in determining the merits of a team's success each season.

Now on to the business of analyzing this beast, which is, I think, the most aesthetically groovy robot I've seen in my FIRST career (even with the eventual attachment of red/blue bumpers). I can see three sets of black tubing that appear to be tensioned by your arm's probably large tilt system reduction when it tilts back to grab the tower. I also see what I think maybe kinda sorta is two different attachment points near the center of the frame. Definitely one. I presume this tensioning assists the tilt in lifting the robot's max moment up from horizontal. Can you share any clarifications and further details of this particular part of your lift system?

Now I'm off to find a CNC sheet metal company in Northeast Ohio.
Thanks Travis. Sometimes I, and I'm sure many others, need reminders like this to keep our heads on straight.

148 and the rest of team IFI and their success has driven our collaborative partners in EWCP to reach a higher level to compete against formidable teams. EWCP wants to be these teams (and later on, beat them if possible).

Its very cliche, but you guys really don't know how much you inspire me to better every team I come in contact with, including my own. This is my heartfelt thank you, for just being you and doing the things you do.
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Last edited by Akash Rastogi : 23-02-2010 at 00:44.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 00:43
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Copioli View Post
I will be at FLR with 217 on week 1, Cass Tech with 217 week 2, Dallas with 148 week 3, week 4 off, and week 5 with 148 in Dallas.
pssst week 5 = Lone Star, Paul, Lone Star. On your way back from New Zealand, stop by Austin and we'll point you in the right direction.

Travel safe. It's wonderful to have you here in Texas!

Jane
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Unread 23-02-2010, 00:58
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

I hope we see you guys in Atlanta
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Unread 23-02-2010, 01:31
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Numbering the bottom was a nice touch.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 01:33
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

The girl in the back is not wearing safety goggles. not only is this a detriment to her own health but this sets a bad example to the many visitors to chiefdelphi.

Remember, Safety is for squares. Squares made up of the 4 equally important virtues of safety which include: Proper training, PROTECTION, proper attire, and common sense.
Please, nbext time you create a video such as this, please remember to wear your safety goggles. as a mentor of my own team, i often try and make a big deal of this because i have seen the horrors of machine shop accidents gone bad.
Sorry for the rant and good luck the rest of the season!
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Unread 23-02-2010, 02:03
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

What is the mechanism that is locking onto the bar? How does it work?
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Unread 23-02-2010, 02:42
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

It is called a gate latch and we took the idea from the 217 1999 robot. Yes, we actually used something from our rookie year.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 02:50
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Thats interesting. So the weight of the robot is holding the whole system in place. Awesome design 217 and 148. Hope we can compete with both of the teams at the championships!
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Unread 23-02-2010, 10:36
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Now that I've watched this video five or more times, I feel like I can make an educated comment on "Armadillo" and the Team 148/217 (And whatever other teams are in this whole team IFI) Collaboration.

As I saw robots being posted up on CD this year, I kept thinking to myself "None of these robots have the capability to dominate a match". I began to think to myself that there would be no way any single machine could dominate a match this year, similar to lunacy.

Then I saw this video. I realized that Breakaway could be dominated. I also realized a lot of other things, things that I thought I already knew. I noticed that Team 148 (and presumably 217) do substantial amount of prototyping before they even start to design robots. This is where we've failed every year. We look at the game a design a machine from day one and we always are trying to finish as early as possible. I never thought to slow things down and prototype and research and just play around with some concepts. Maybe next year we'll have to take this new approach.

Regardless, Armadillo is surely one hell of a machine.
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Unread 23-02-2010, 11:28
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

Just wanted to say that I saw your video, and your robot looks awesome. I love the kicking and hanging mechanism. Great job!
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Unread 23-02-2010, 12:08
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

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Originally Posted by thefro526 View Post
I noticed that Team 148 (and presumably 217) do substantial amount of prototyping before they even start to design robots. This is where we've failed every year. We look at the game a design a machine from day one and we always are trying to finish as early as possible. I never thought to slow things down and prototype and research and just play around with some concepts. Maybe next year we'll have to take this new approach.
Team 148 has clearly spent a lot of time tailoring and streamlining their engineering process which enables them to spend more time in the early design steps. My occupational experience (and research in defect analysis) tells me that dedicating more time up front provides the biggest return on their labor investment. In order to generate this time, they have become extremely efficient in modeling, production, integration, and to some extent testing.

The beauty of teams like 148 is that they tell you exactly how they achieve their success (see JVN's engineering design whitepaper, full CAD models of 2008/2009 robots, and the "How it is Made" video among other resources they have produced). I think the trouble many teams have (mine included) is that the engineering process is applied ad hoc and even if following a proven process there is no analysis of the process itself for where to eliminate waste and optimize the implementation of each step. For example, if it takes to long to integrate subcomponents try modeling more. If it takes to long to model, train more students in the off season and become really proficient. I think without an efficient engineering process, the only hope teams have of being reliably competitive is to (1) out work the competition (probably not practical and it is a hard way to go even if it was) or (2) out think the competition (unreliable). Team 148 is demonstrating what engineering should be all about and is showing that it works!
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Unread 23-02-2010, 12:24
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Re: pic: Team 148 - Robowranglers 2010 - Armadillo

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Originally Posted by Dmentor View Post
Team 148 has clearly spent a lot of time tailoring and streamlining their engineering process which enables them to spend more time in the early design steps. My occupational experience (and research in defect analysis) tells me that dedicating more time up front provides the biggest return on their labor investment. In order to generate this time, they have become extremely efficient in modeling, production, integration, and to some extent testing.
BINGO... ie DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME!!! If any regular team spent 3 weeks prototyping, they would be in a world of hurt because their parts would never get finished in time to even build a robot. I know this because in 2006 1511 spent that 3 weeks prototyping, and finally abandoned all prototypes and went with a concept we figured would work, no design, we just built it... fortunately we survived, but we most certainly did NOT come out with an elegant machine, and did not have enough test or programming time. Dmentor hit it on the head, its that they have trained their students and team so well on design, and have great manufacturing support and capability, and THAT allows them to prototype for that long to come up with the best solutions. Until you get to that level of engineering process, in my mind you CANNOT spend 3 weeks prototyping or you will shoot yourself in the foot.

I would still suggesting picking 1 design right up front and racing to finish it as fast as you can so you have debug and programming time at the end, unless you have an insanely well trained and well oiled team (hint use preseason wisely). My bet is that once they pick their designs, teams like 148 & 217 can crank out full designs in 4-5 days, manufacture in 3-4 days, and then still have time to test. 1511's best robot design was probably 2008, and that took us 4 weeks of CAD design, because we are NOT proficient enough. It worked for us because we picked the design by day 2, designed for 4 weeks, had parts built along the way and were left with about a week to debug & program, but there is no way we had time for 3 weeks of prototyping.

Maybe John or Paul could post a sample schedule that they follow...
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