Team update 16

[Alex Cormier]

In my opinion, the update was both good and bad.

In one hand, it was great to see the GDC noticed that their system had a major flaw. In the other hand, the best time to have put out this update was before the "official" regionals start.

My team played in a week 1 regional and was a subject to every change in the update.

We were the first team to get a yellow card from G46 (match #1 of FLR), we played 6v0 matches (match 58 and 63), and we got a yellow card which turned to a red card for G30 (early Friday). Interesting how every change in this update was a little reflect of what 3181 did on the playing field. (Maybe the update should be changed to Update #3181 )

It is a horrible thing that teams pay in full for the local regional and even away regionals on week 1 and the system changes drastically after the fact. I have no problem with decreasing the amount of week 1 regionals or decrease the amount of registration or have more official week 0 events to work everything out.

I will not walk away from FIRST from this point, I truly believe in this program and I will further mentor teams in my area that need help. I have gone through this system and I love it. There just needs to be some changes.

[coldfusion1279]

Thanks GDC.

It's a shame the week 1 regionals went the way they did... but better late than never I suppose. On to week 2! (and on to different concerns with the ranking system?... I hope not)

[Akash Rastogi]

I question why we keep attending a week 1 regional.

This is barely a thank you to the GDC.

[thelittlesister]

Wish FLR wasn't week 1 but im glad GDC has found a solution! Week 1 participants were more or less the ginuea pigs for the trial, but i'm glad all the other weeks will be better...hopefully! =P Thanks!

[JesseK]

Thanks GDC. I understand the intent of the new seeding system, and sometimes even the best of intentions lead to unexpected consequences.

Madison, iirc, you have an FTC team going to Atlanta too right? We'll see ya down there (FTC1885). I'm just glad I won't miss the conferences this year.

[George A.]

I want to commend the GDC, because frankly they were going to upset people regardless of how they acted.


If they let things continue the way they had been going, we would have gone through 5 weeks of regionals, and the Championship with people outraged at the seeding system, and way the rankings were ending up. (The Bayou regional is a good testament to why they had to change it)

On the other hand, if they do change it (as they have) yes, the people playing in the week 1 regionals kind of got screwed, but they did the greatest good for the greatest number. This way at least the final 4 weeks of regionals can be played with how the game should be played.

Would it have been ideal to have this update before regionals? Yes, but in some of the scrimmages I saw, robots were struggling to move let alone score. So there was no way to really know how things would play out.

So let's give them credit, they saw an issue, made a tough decision as to whether to fix it or ride out the storm, and did what they felt was in the program's best interest. In my opinion, it should make the final weeks a bit more entertaining.

[cmh0114]

I'm also one of the people who saw no object with the 6v0 method. I wouldn't say that I liked it, but I was okay with it as a valid strategy.
Now, I don't have to worry about that! No more scoring on your opponent in order to get double seeding points, either. This will bring it so much closer to the wins/losses systems we've had in the past.
I can't wait to see how this turns out!

[Swampdude]

MUCHO RESPECT GDC!!! BRAVO!!! That's how to demonstrate good practices. I think in addition to this perhaps next season 2010 week 1 teams could elect to get a break on registration fees perhaps. This changed my whole attitude about Florida. I was almost dreading it....

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Swampdude

This changed my whole attitude about Florida. I was almost dreading it....

This changed my whole attitude about the 2nd week, period. It's very difficult watching and wondering what's going to happen by 3rd week, 4th week, 5th week. We all do that anyway but, this year it was awful. I honestly broke out in hives on Saturday and I can't remember the last time I've broken out in hives. The concern for the teams/game was difficult to manage. From here on out, when discussions start about the 2010 FRC game, my first thought is going to be, hives.

Jane

[George1902]

Originally Posted by cmh0114

No more scoring on your opponent in order to get double seeding points, either.

Why not? This update didn't remove the coopertition bonus.

If I'm winning 8-2 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 10-2 or 8-4? The former nets me a seeding score of 19 under the new rules, while the latter nets me a seeding score of 21. The incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Vice versa, if I'm losing 2-8 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 4-8 or 2-10? The former nets me a seeding score of 8 while the latter nets me a seeding score of 10. Once again, the incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Can someone explain to me what is different with this update? Yes, there is a bigger reward for winning, but once the match is out of reach for one alliance, 6v0 comes back into play.

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by George1902

Can someone explain to me what is different with this update? Yes, there is a bigger reward for winning, but once the match is out of reach for one alliance, 6v0 comes back into play.

6v0 is not a catch all term for all cross goal scoring and I wish people would stop using it as such.

This update prevents pre arranging a match to have one winner and one loser, since the winner gets 5 more points.

[Swampdude]

Originally Posted by George1902

Why not? This update didn't remove the coopertition bonus.

If I'm winning 8-2 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 10-2 or 8-4? The former nets me a seeding score of 19 under the new rules, while the latter nets me a seeding score of 21. The incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Vice versa, if I'm losing 2-8 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 4-8 or 2-10? The former nets me a seeding score of 8 while the latter nets me a seeding score of 10. Once again, the incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Can someone explain to me what is different with this update? Yes, there is a bigger reward for winning, but once the match is out of reach for one alliance, 6v0 comes back into play.

I think 5 points and the threat of ball incursion penalties gone gives enough clear incentive to want to be the winner, where it didn't matter before. That's an important dynamic that should eliminate most of the predetermined 6v0 collusion. You're right, it's still there but I think this will put the winners where they belong.. on top.. and it's better than what we had! Looking forward to seeing you George!

[Nawaid Ladak]

Originally Posted by George1902

Why not? This update didn't remove the coopertition bonus.

If I'm winning 8-2 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 10-2 or 8-4? The former nets me a seeding score of 19 under the new rules, while the latter nets me a seeding score of 21. The incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Vice versa, if I'm losing 2-8 with 30 seconds left and 2 balls to score, do I make the score 4-8 or 2-10? The former nets me a seeding score of 8 while the latter nets me a seeding score of 10. Once again, the incentive is still to score for the other alliance.

Can someone explain to me what is different with this update? Yes, there is a bigger reward for winning, but once the match is out of reach for one alliance, 6v0 comes back into play.

Your absolutely right in this. the reward for winning was the coopertition bonus. The GDC didn't need to add a incentive to win.

What i think is happening here is people are getting too hyped up for what the GDC did, All this does is stop matches from being fixed between two even alliances. If i knew i was going to lose. I would still play 6v0. it would STILL net me the most seeding points that my alliance could possibly gain from that match.

Sure this gives you more incentive to win (in qualification matches) . but wasn't that already a goal? (coopertition bonus, moves you to the top of the pack easier than a 6v0)

[dtengineering]

Originally Posted by Nawaid Ladak

Sure this gives you more incentive to win. but wasn't that already a goal?

Winning the tournament is one goal. Winning a qualification match is another.

Now the two goals have a lot more in common with each other than they did a week ago.

Jason

[waialua359]

This changes nothing for our team.
We played to win every match last week and for the most part, that's how the SD regional was played.
In the end it worked out for the best.

Good luck in week 2 everyone!!!!