High score of the season

[BHS_STopping]

Originally Posted by JABot67

If a robot was strong enough, could it go through the tunnel and push 469 out of the way?

Perhaps, if a robot weighed 120 lbs and had some traction behind it. 469 could easily remedy this though, adding weight and maybe a braking mechanism to keep their wheels from spinning.

Oh dear, does this mean they can actually become *better*?

[johnr]

Someone will be able to stop them. Get to tower first and have traction wheels. They do have to cross field and other side starts right next to tower. There will be alot of code being written because of them. The 469 code.

[Lil' Lavery]

Do note that 469 is still pretty good when acting like a "normal" robot, as well. They typically are clearing balls out of the neutral zone in autonomous before they go into the tunnel (and sometimes scoring them) and in QF1-2 they left the tunnel due to a ball jam and scored a ball from the neutral zone during tele-op.

If the other alliance wants to commit a robot to wedging itself into the tunnel in order to stop 469, they'll then have to try and win a match 2v3. I don't like those odds very much, either.

[hipsterjr]

Is this not the "God bot" strategy everyone said would never work . Props to 469 for being brave enough to try it and for being awesome enough to perfect it.

[ZeroGAdam]

Does anyone have any video of this amazing match?

[fuzzy1718]

the reason no one can move them is that they have a springboard that goes under the tunnel and actually lifts up on the tower. They are effectively wedged in their position. This actually causes a problem; In one of the semis or finals (I dont remeber) they lifted the tower so much that the balls wouldnt roll down the return rails... so chickens decided to high speed ram it and bend it all out of wack in order to get them to come down... but no penalties were called so they were all good.

[BHS_STopping]

I threw together a quick drawing of what 469's robot essentially does. It's my best interpretation of things after watching a few Cass Tech matches.

http://img705.imageshack.us/i/469i.png/

[TKM.368]

You can catch some of 469 here, but none of it as impressive as their semifinal and final matches.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/5391497

Match 28 00:07:45
Match 34 01:04:56 (they can be defended against!)
Match 39 01:58:54

Much of what they did in the elims was off camera in these matches.

[Epic]

"Someone will be able to stop them. Get to tower first and have traction wheels. They do have to cross field and other side starts right next to tower. There will be alot of code being written because of them. The 469 code."

I'm on 2185 who played against 469 twice. The first time we played, we successfully made an auton to keep them out of the tunnel. They were unable to set up their mechanism so I guess we could be one of the first teams to make a 469 code. Our robot is built for traction so it worked well.

Unfortunately, the second time we played them was in the 25-1 match in the semifinals but oh well.

Congrats team 469 on a great design.

[11Mort11]

Originally Posted by BJC

They just did it again in the next match 26 to 1

I'm calling best robot of the year already

Lol robowranglers have the exact same one as 217 its gonna be insane at nationals

[Edoc'sil]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but any tank tread drive should be able to push them around, assuming that is that 469 doesn't have treads.

[nuggetsyl]

Ok before i get railed with neg rep and all other fun things that will come with this post. I want to say i am truly asking this because i do not fully understand 469 robot. I watched video( http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/5391497) today of 469 and to me it looks like a clear violation of rule r19. The rule was addressed with gdc. ( http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread.php?t=14077 ) Is the ramp they build not a MECHANISM??? If it is not then i know where i am wrong.

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by nuggetsyl

Ok before i get railed with neg rep and all other fun things that will come with this post. I want to say i am truly asking this because i do not fully understand 469 robot. I watched video( http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/5391497) today of 469 and to me it looks like a clear violation of rule r19. The rule was addressed with gdc. ( http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread.php?t=14077 ) Is the ramp they build not a MECHANISM??? If it is not then i know where i am wrong.

The ramp is a mechanism, but the ball never more than within 3" of it, so therefor it is not a penalty. Per the last sentence of the Q&A you quoted:

A situation where the BALL traverses "inside" the robot boundaries (e.g. as it falls from the BALL RETURN and bounces off the top of the ROBOT), but does not enter a MECHANISM by more than the permitted 3 inches, would not be PENALIZED

Originally Posted by Edoc'sil

Correct me if I'm wrong, but any tank tread drive should be able to push them around, assuming that is that 469 doesn't have treads.

Since you told me to correct you, I will. Treads don't automatically mean more traction. And beyond that, they have a mechanism designed to wedge them into position once they reach the tunnel.

[Tom Line]

I'll elaborate on their design.

First - they're autonomous kicks the two balls from the middle zone into the goal on their way to the tower. This primes the system to recycle balls.

Second - they've got traction wheels. Someone here says they do well when not locked on - that really isn't very true. They have difficulty turning, aren't very fast, and can't do much of anything if defended. That isn't a knock on their bot. Frankly, it's incredibly effective at what is does. There is NO OTHER WAY you're going to average 1 ball every 4 seconds.

Third - they physically lock onto the tower. With large aluminum plates onto the bar. They push the center platform up because they drive into the bar to lock on and their front lifts up when they do lock as a result of their wheels still driving. There's pretty much no point in trying to move them - in fact they moved the entire field twice when they were locking on.

Fourth - you can block them. You have to travel partially into the tunnel at an angle. A number of teams were at the practice field programming auton to do exactly that. Once you stop them from locking in, there no better (and in fact a bit worse) than many other bots. They have a good kicker and a good ball sucker, but they are slow-slow-slow. Don't count on that continuing long though - they're Las Guerillas after all.

Fifth - Corey, there were good teams at Cass Tech. However, the Guerilla's have a reasonably simply answer to that. The person in their offensive zone plays DEFENSE on the bot there. That way the guerillas can shoot to the clear side of the field. They had occasional problems during qualifications when they didn't have a good offensive partner to get the balls in to get the cycle started, or if they missed their shot in auton.

Editted to make it more polite:

There were many good teams there that got squished by 469's system. Saying that teams there didn't provide decent competition is rather poor form, very unfair, and entirely untrue.

[Chris is me]

This strategy has countermeasures, but seems like something extremely tricky. I don't want to call choke-hold just yet though. I want to see a team park wide in front of the tunnel, perfectly centered, for example. Alternately, defense of the return or initial ball hoarding.