Team 217 - Thunderchickens

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by fuzzy1718

because they know how mob mentality is. I'm not taking either side of this debate, it is napalm to one and all, but the anonymous account thing I will comment on. Anyone who says anything in the FIRST community that isn't "politically correct" gets slammed, both individually and their team. It is a smart thing to do posting anonymously, their team doesn't get harmed and neither do they. And for those who think it is dishonorable and a sneaky stab in the back, what would you do? Put the reputation of your team on the line or post anonymously? Those who will retort back to my post with the "if you don't have something nice to say, then don't say it" remark: if this thread really burned your shorts would you sit back and let it go on?

It is absolutely dishonourable. If you can't stand behind what you have to say, why bother saying it? I'm well aware that anything I say on these forums is a reflection both upon myself and my team. If I'm not willing to put that reputation on the line, then I'll keep my mouth shut. (Keep in mind I've had my share of controversial moments on these forums and said some pretty blunt things, ask someone on Team 48 if you don't believe me.) It's much easier to criticize someone when shielded by a shroud of anonymity. It's the equivalent of putting a mask on and running up to a kid in school and saying "you're ugly". It's juvenile and ridiculous.

/Edit

Also, posting anonymously is completely unproductive. No one takes these anonymous posts seriously. If the original poster actually had concerns with how 217 was being run, there are about 1000 other constructive ways to address the issue. Perhaps going up to Mike Copioli and saying "Hey Mike, I think your team has some problems, I was hoping we could discuss them". By hurling anonymous insults on an internet forum, the post has accomplished absolutely nothing. (Aside from wasting may time...)

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by Karthik

It is absolutely dishonourable. If you can't stand behind what you have to say, why bother saying it? I'm well aware that anything I say on these forums is a reflection both upon myself and my team. If I'm not willing to put that reputation on the line, then I'll keep my mouth shut. (Keep in mind I've had my share of controversial moments on these forums and said some pretty blunt things, ask someone on Team 48 if you don't believe me.) It's much easier to criticize someone when shielded by a shroud of anonymity. It's the equivalent of putting a mask on and running up to a kid in school and saying "you're ugly". It's juvenile and ridiculous.

/Edit

Also, posting anonymously is completely unproductive. No one takes these anonymous posts seriously. If the original poster actually had concerns with how 217 was being run, there are about 1000 other constructive ways to address the issue. Perhaps going up to Mike Copioli and saying "Hey Mike, I think your team has some problems, I was hoping we could discuss them". By hurling anonymous insults on an internet forum, the post has accomplished absolutely nothing. (Aside from wasting may time...)

/Edit #2 (Since I've already wasted my time)

The Thunderchickens are one of the best run teams in all of FIRST. They arguably have one of the most intelligent student groups of any team in FIRST. (The "ringers" as we've dubbed them) Each year they astonish me with what they accomplish and have probably done more to inspire my methods of mentoring on 1114 than any other team in FIRST. So yeah.

[Mike Schreiber]

Originally Posted by Karthik

The Thunderchickens are one of the best run teams in all of FIRST. They arguably have one of the most intelligent student groups of any team in FIRST. (The "ringers" as we've dubbed them) Each year they astonish me with what they accomplish and have probably done more to inspire my methods of mentoring on 1114 than any other team in FIRST. So yeah.

I would like to argue that point. By no means am I going to call their students unintelligent, but I believe that how well a team doesn't necessarily have a direct correlation to the intelligence of the students. Yes a team that does have smart kids is going to do better than with students who are lacking that feat, but if a student from another team was put in a position with as many educational resources (sponsors and mentors who know their stuff) as a thunder chicken student I am 100% confident they would still do well.

For example Team 397 has never won a regional, but that doesn't mean our students aren't as smart. Our students just realize that we must build within our limitations and since there are only 5 of them this year we physically could not put together a thunder chicken machine even if we put every day all day into it. We came up with all sorts of strategies and designs that we see being used, but because of our financial and labor limitations we know we couldn't do it.

I agree the thunder chicken students are smart, but I think that there are many less privileged FIRST students who are smart, and it saddens me that they don't all get the recognition that students like those on the thunder chickens do.

I would also like to comment on one of Baby Cakes comments:
"The driver on the team when asked if he was excited at the cass tech district said " not really, i know we are going to win it"."

I sincerely hope that this is not true, because if it is I am actually disturbed and offended. There is a fine line between pride and arrogance, and I'm sure the mentors of team 217 know how to deal with such issues because that is a terrible reflection of an excellent team. I will leave it at that.

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by ICanCountTo19

I would like to argue that point. By no means am I going to call their students unintelligent, but I believe that how well a team doesn't necessarily have a direct correlation to the intelligence of the students. Yes a team that does have smart kids is going to do better than with students who are lacking that feat, but if a student from another team was put in a position with as many educational resources (sponsors and mentors who know their stuff) as a thunder chicken student I am 100% confident they would still do well.

...

I agree the thunder chicken students are smart, but I think that there are many less privileged FIRST students who are smart, and it saddens me that they don't all get the recognition that students like those on the thunder chickens do.

Michael,

I agree that there are thousands of team with thousands of very intelligent students. My post was based on my first hand interactions with the Thunderchicken students since 2006 as opposed to any success they have had on the field. Each year I meet a more than a handful of them who dazzle me with their intellect. I normally wouldn't have pointed something out like this, but in light of the implications of the original poster I felt that someone needed to point out the outstanding abilities of these students, despite of claims/implications to the contrary.

It would be great if we could recognize every student in this program, but thankfully not every team needs their reputation boosted a bit after being tossed baseless insults in a public forum like 217 was tonight.

[Mike Schreiber]

Originally Posted by Karthik

Michael,

I agree that there are thousands of team with thousands of very intelligent students. My post was based on my first hand interactions with the Thunderchicken students since 2006 as opposed to any success they have had on the field. Each year I meet a more than a handful of them who dazzle me with their intellect. I normally wouldn't have pointed something out like this, but in light of the implications of the original poster I felt that someone needed to point out the outstanding abilities of these students, despite of claims/implications to the contrary.

It would be great if we could recognize every student in this program, but thankfully not every team needs their reputation boosted a bit after being tossed baseless insults in a public forum like 217 was tonight.

That makes more sense now, I completely understand your defense of these students, the thunder chicken students do get bashed every year as do yours. Must get old having to point it out every year to anonymous posters though...

[HashemReza]

I unfortunately forgot to do so beforehand, so let me take the time now to applaud the drive, dedication, and intelligence of every team member of 1114, 217, and the other IFI teams who spent many hours perfecting their robot. Furthermore, I would like to thank the mentors for each of those teams, as it is by those same qualities that you have shaped such successful 'dynasties'. I look forward to playing Breakaway with all of you at Championship, and continuing to learn from you all in years of mentoring to come.

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by ICanCountTo19

That makes more sense now, I completely understand your defense of these students, the thunder chicken students do get bashed every year as do yours. Must get old having to point it out every year to anonymous posters though...

[comic relief]
I'm telling you guys,

everyone's just jealous of the cowboy and chicken motifs, not the robots. [/comic relief]

But really, can there be a part in CD registration that requires a team number or team name please?

...Or any other ideas to prevent idiotic & arrogant posters from making false accounts?

[IBdrummer]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

But really, can there be a part in CD registration that requires a team number or team name please?

...Or any other ideas to prevent idiotic & arrogant posters from making false accounts?

I'm not so sure that would solve the problem because they'd probably just make up a team or use some other teams number/name.

Is there anyway the posts or accounts can be deleted though? I can't see how that post has done any good or done anything other than anger members and take away from the original thread's intentions.

[Dmentor]

Originally Posted by Karthik

By hurling anonymous insults on an internet forum, the post has accomplished absolutely nothing. (Aside from wasting my time...)

Originally Posted by Karthik

/Edit #2 (Since I've already wasted my time)

Sticking up for friends is one of best uses of time that I know of. Thunderchickens young and old will see a derogatory post followed by an outpouring of supporting comments from some of FIRST's finest. Robots may come and go but hopefully the friendships and camaraderie formed within FIRST will last a lifetime.

[Andy Baker]

This story may be interesting:

I had the pleasure of meeting a student on a FIRST team in 1999 named Eric Gargus. He was the senior student leader on this team. We had an a match together at the Midwest Regional. He was his team's driver and I was our drive team coach. His team was having a tough time, as their robot was not good. He was venting to me about drama within his team and I just listened, not really knowing what sort of advice to give.

I saw Eric again at the Championships, and he said that his team was doing better, but he was still frustrated. He told me that his team did not like my team, since our team has too many engineers involved and we have this huge sponsor (Delphi) who gives us everything. He also said that they don't like us because we won too much (we won the Championships during the prior year).

Guess what team Eric was on? At the time, this team was called "Team McComb", and their team number was 217. Yep, this is the same 217, and now they are known as the Thunderchickens.

It looks to me like the Thunderchickens decided to DO SOMETHING about their frustration instead of whine about it. Good for them, and good for the rest of FIRST. We are all better because of this can-do attitude.

So, if your team gets trounced by one of these top-notch teams, you can do two things:

1. Whine and complain
2. Go to their pits, talk to their team, and learn what makes them excellent

I bet it won't take more than 2-3 years for your team to become great like the Thunderchickens. It is very hard work, but it will be worth it.

Go, be excellent.

Sincerely,
Andy Baker

[Martinez]

Their machine is a beast. They have excellent drivers. And have some of the best mentors in all of FIRST. Frankly, It could be the biggest upset I've ever seen if they are NOT on Einstein. Simply put, if you don't defeat them in the first 20 seconds by Championship time, you won't beat them at all.

[dtengineering]

We might not be as good as 217, or the other traditional "powerhouse" teams... but we are better because of them.

Jason

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

We might not be as good as 217, or the other traditional "powerhouse" teams... but we are better because of them.

Jason

Best statement I've seen in the entire thread.

My friends, my team, and myself look up to Team IFI for many reasons. We do NOT always agree with their methods, but we always agree with their outputs and results. I have kids on team 11 who out right hate the CADing of parts and sending them out to a shop, these are kids who don't get what exactly Team IFI is all about. But they do learn a heck of a lot each year when these teams unveil their robots and help us out each and ever year.

Of course, I would never want to leave out teams outside of IFI such as 111 and 71 in a "thank you for inspiring our team" thread.

[Squeakypig]

I would have to say 217 is probably the most inspiring team for my team, 2851. Besides being the "little brother" of 217, our teams didn't have the best 'feelings' for eachother last year. And yet despite all of this we still respect eachother as amazing teams. If it weren't for 217, Crevolution wouldn't be the team it is now, to thrive to be as good as the Thunderchickens (and eventually beat them ) is our goal. It is not a very fun time when people mention a Sterling Heights team and they all of a suden think 217. It is because of this I love the Thunderchickens, they make us strive. O the leaps and bounds we made from our rookie year last year to this year, absolutely stunning in my opinion.

And also, i have heard the rumors about the TC robot being "mentor designed" and I know this not to be true. Many of my school mates on TC have told me so, and i highly doubt all 20 of my closest friends would be lying to me. Sterling Heights does not know that word 'conspiracy'.

So in the end, I want to thank the Thunderchickens. You handed us our biggest lose this year, and because of it our robot...well let's just say it's got a little more bit (see my profile picture to understand the pun)

[Ryan Caldwell]

Bite!!! puns work best when they are actual puns!

love to see the good out ways the bad by a large margin on this post, just like FIRST

Big Shoes Chickens and unfortunately you out grow them every year