Thank you teams 365 486 and 341

[Radical Pi]

This is another thank you to teams 365, 486, and 341 for helping us play in the semis

For Eliminations at Philly, our alliance faced these teams in the semis. During the events of the first match, our defensive bot's cRIO blew out and caused the entire robot to die. We took our timeout to try and reflash the spare cRIO with v20 and re-download code, however the timeout was not enough time to finish this. When we told our opponents that the bot was still not ready, they made a true show of GP and gave us their timeout to finish the repairs. The bot was fully operational for the second match, and we were able to give our opponents a run for their money. It was an excellent match with a loss to us by 1 penalty.

Congratulations on winning the regional to those teams, and it is the opinion of most of our team that one of you should have been the winner of the GP award

[jblay]

I was watching the webcast and was amazed when this happened. This is one of the most GP things I have seen in my time in FIRST. Congratulations to teams 365, 486, and 341 on winning especially to 341; your bot is awesome and I can't wait to see you guys again in Atlanta. I'm sure everyone in the FIRST community is impressed with the actions your alliance took.

[Vikesrock]

While the spirit of the gesture is certainly fantastic, it should be noted that this is actually against the rules.

<T21> In the elimination matches, each ALLIANCE will be allotted one TIMEOUT of up to 6 minutes. If an ALLIANCE wishes to call for a TIMEOUT, they must submit their TIMEOUT coupon to the Head Referee within two minutes of the Head Referee issuing the arena reset signal preceding their MATCH. When this occurs, the Time-out Clock will count down the six minutes starting with the expiration of the arena reset period. Both ALLIANCES will enjoy the complete 6-minute window. In the interest of tournament schedule, if an ALLIANCE completes their repairs before the Time-out Clock expires, the ALLIANCE CAPTAIN is encouraged to inform the Head Referee that they are ready to play and remit any time remaining in the TIMEOUT. If ALLIANCES are ready before the 6-minute window, the next MATCH will start. There are no cascading time-outs. An opposing ALLIANCE may not offer their unused TIMEOUT to their opponent.

The cascading timeouts issue is much more cut and dry than the part about offering your timeout to your opponent which can easily be worked around.

[Grim Tuesday]

I salute the teams as well. I find it very weird that the GDC would ban an obvious act of GP.

It is also furthermore, slightly disturbing that the refs didn't catch it.

[Jared Russell]

Originally Posted by Vikesrock

While the spirit of the gesture is certainly fantastic, it should be noted that this is actually against the rules.

The cascading timeouts issue is much more cut and dry than the part about offering your timeout to your opponent which can easily be worked around.

The wording of this rule clearly states that the intent is to prevent the excessive lagging behind schedule that is typical of many/most FIRST events ("In the interest of tournament schedule..."). However, thanks to the amazing volunteers at Philly we were running well ahead of schedule each and every day. They even had to interject some song and dance numbers between the quarterfinal matches in order to slow things down! As a result, an extra timeout did not hurt the flow of things at all, and every single person in the building would agree that allowing it to be called was the right call.

[Foster]

Originally Posted by Jared341

The wording of this rule clearly states that the intent is to prevent the excessive lagging behind schedule that is typical of many/most FIRST events ("In the interest of tournament schedule..."). However, thanks to the amazing volunteers at Philly we were running well ahead of schedule each and every day. They even had to interject some song and dance numbers between the quarterfinal matches in order to slow things down! As a result, an extra timeout did not hurt the flow of things at all, and every single person in the building would agree that allowing it to be called was the right call.

It's not often that the Pit Announcer says "Just a reminder teams, we are running 15 minutes ahead of schedule, please listen for the queue announcements."

We were on the alliance with Diablo as they replaced their cRio. Swapping out the hardware and watching their programming team format and load code under huge pressure in such a calm and efficent manner was incredible to watch.

There are no cascading time-outs. An opposing ALLIANCE may not offer their unused TIMEOUT to their opponent.

I'm pretty sure there was something broken on the other side of the field Thanks 341, 365 and 486!

[George A.]

I was impressed that The #1 seed offered up their time out. And even more proud when the entire arena applauded at their effort.

Granted it might have not been in the rules had we followed them to the letter. But the rules also state that the teams have to be on the field at the end of the time out. Most of the times the refs are lenient about that as well. (I know there have been some exceptions, I don't want to start a flame war here)

The referees and the scoring table figured that since we were running ahead of schedule, we would go ahead and allow it since it would be easier for them to get the timeout, versus us not letting them....neither team moving, forcing a tie, and then we would have had to wait longer.


All in all the Philly was a tremendous success, and according to our FTA (one of the best in the business) we had the best average reset time of any regional this year.

[Grim Tuesday]

Originally Posted by George A.

The referees and the scoring table figured that since we were running ahead of schedule, we would go ahead and allow it since it would be easier for them to get the timeout, versus us not letting them....neither team moving, forcing a tie, and then we would have had to wait longer.

I am not really sure what you mean by that paragraph. If they had not given us the time out then, 87 would have not moved, and we would have suffered a humiliating defeat. However, with us getting it, we ended up with a loss of 7-8, which I consider quite good against the champs of two regionals.

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by Grim Tuesday

I am not really sure what you mean by that paragraph. If they had not given us the time out then, 87 would have not moved, and we would have suffered a humiliating defeat. However, with us getting it, we ended up with a loss of 7-8, which I consider quite good against the champs of two regionals.

If the refs disallowed the cascading timeout the #1 alliance may have suggested that both alliances immediately E-stop their robots. A very boring two minutes and fifteen seconds would then ensue with the match ending in a 0-0 tie. Your alliance would have then had the full reset time, plus potentially the #1 alliances timeout. This scenario is a good indicator that the rule is not a good one as enforcing it will result in greater delays if the alliance decides that they truly want to give the opposing alliance as much time as possible.

I also want to point out that me pointing out the rules was not intended as any disrespect towards the #1 alliance or towards the referees/event officials. I have great respect and admiration for both the gesture made by the #1 alliance and the referees for allowing it, I feel that this rule is unnecessary and should not be in the rulebook.

[Grim Tuesday]

I didn't take any of your message as disrespect for the #1 alliance: Just knowing the rules better than me and Radical Pi (Knowing him, thats a very hard thing to do)

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by Grim Tuesday

I didn't take any of your message as disrespect for the #1 alliance: Just knowing the rules better than me and Radical Pi (Knowing him, thats a very hard thing to do)

Sorry, that last part of my previous post didn't really have anything to do with my response to your post. It was just something I wanted to make sure was clear after thinking a little more about the thread and what I had posted in it.

[eovnu87435ds]

I was the driver/programmer of team 87's bot at philly, and I too would like to personally thank alliance #1. I'm sure moe just wanted to have a fair fight against us after Qual. #66

In all seriousness though, you guys were awesome out there in letting us finish up the robot. And it made for an awesome 8-8 match before penalties. That was truly the most exciting match I have ever seen, and I'm sure it was the same for many of those in the stands as well.

I also would like to thank you all for the compliments on our team, as well.

And I would also like to thank 639 and 1640 for your support during these issues. We made it far and we sure put on one hell of a show!

[Mr MOE]

Great show 639-87-1640. I am sure you would have given us your time out should we have needed it (regardless of the rules).

You were a terrific alliance and, with each of your bots working well, we knew we were in for a close match.

Congrats on your showing at Philly!

[OZ_341]

Originally Posted by eovnu87435ds

I was the driver/programmer of team 87's bot at philly, and I too would like to personally thank alliance #1. I'm sure moe just wanted to have a fair fight against us after Qual. #66 .........

We watched Q66 very carefully and knew you were very dangerous. 87 was the bot that I feared the most. You guys could really control a match. Nice work.