After Coming Back From The LA Regional: My Thoughts On FIRST

[davidthefat]

Originally Posted by IBdrummer

A lot of the most spirited/weird/out there teams are that way because they embrace FIRST, but not only the spirit side, also the professional side. As a FIRST alumni of 233 I wish my team was the most spirited and colorful out there this weekend, but I know for as much effort they put into being spirited and cheering, they put at least ten times that into being professional. Judges like color because it shows enthusiasm for the competition and equally important to them is knowing your robot. FIRST might not always make sense to an outside observer; and trust me I'm no fan of the BCS (even if it helps my team out...Go gators!), but you have to look past the colorful outfits and screaming teams to get the real point of FIRST, Inspiration. If they have all these kids screaming at the top of their lungs for science and technology, then they're doing something right. FIRST changed me from a lawyer to a mechanical engineering student in college and that is something I will never forget.
In terms of the finals, I know my team as well as most others have a pretty good system down for ranking teams, in which team color isn't a factor. Yes, opinion matters and in selections sometimes luck plays in, but we've picked teams that were plywood boxes before because we thought they were the best team.
If you're a football guy, I'm surprised you aren't a driver (maybe you tried out, idk), but that's probably the best position for a guy who is competitive. I knew thats what I wanted to be, so I went for it, and if you haven't tried it, you might want to go for it because there is nothing funner than being on that field. Just some of my experiences/suggestions, but either way, I hope you give FIRST another shot.

Loved one of your mentor's pink beard... I was a "driver" I just stood next to the actual driver and just got first row seats.. I was the big asian guy with a buzz cut

[IBdrummer]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

Loved one of your mentor's pink beard... I was a "driver" I just stood next to the actual driver and just got first row seats.. I was the big asian guy with a buzz cut

I didn't go lol, I'm at UF...but yeah, thats Mike, hes a great mentor
if you ever see him again, go talk to him, I always learn something new when I talk to him.

[Grim Tuesday]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

I was a "driver" I just stood next to the actual driver and just got first row seats..

Not to be giving suggestions, but if you guys want to actually use the full complement of two drivers like our team does, allocate duties: One driver drives the robot while the other person does the auxiliary tasks, such as kicking and hanging. It has worked great for us every year.

If you guys really dont want to do that, let you second driver be a second pair of eyes, or a coach.

[MagiChau]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

That is true, but I always been taught, get in, get out, get the job done and just say good game, nothing more, nothing less. Always know what your job is and your team mate's job. But I guess that does not apply to FIRST then...

From what I have seen that is different from what I know for FIRST. People communicate with other teams beyond good game. For example at West Michigan District in the pit one of our seniors got approached for an autograph by a person from a different team it was a pretty amusing event if you only seen it. It is good to have teams to work on different parts but everyone can get involved with something else. If you are a programmer you could learn to help with some hardware if the code is finished.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

Just pissed why we didn't make the finals... Just regret is all I remember from the competition.

24 teams make the eliminations. 59 teams are on the team list.That means that 35 teams don't make eliminations, and at least 27 have no chance at all (not high enough of a seed to be a backup robot).

You seeded 20th. This is generally regarded as backup robot territory. As a matter of fact, you were the #6 robot on the backup list (which goes up to 8 robots). This is not the best spot to be in, but at least you have a chance, however slim, of making it into the eliminations.

I have a challenge for you. Instead of focusing on the negative aspects that you observed, find a way to become competitive enough to consistently be in the quarterfinals, or the #1 backup robot. I've looked at your team's history--you've been twice. You've got something that can get you there. You need to cultivate it. (Note: the last time you made it, in 2008, you ran up against 330, 1717, and 980 in quarterfinals while paired with 1538 and 207. There wasn't much anyone could do in that type of situation except fight hard.)

Oh, and try to convince your advisors to sign up for the SCRRF Fall Classic. It's a more low-key post-season event, where you can relax, talk to other teams, and just enjoy the competition. It's also much smaller, giving you more time to interact with other teams and a higher chance of making eliminations.

[davidthefat]

Originally Posted by Grim Tuesday

Not to be giving suggestions, but if you guys want to actually use the full complement of two drivers like our team does, allocate duties: One driver drives the robot while the other person does the auxiliary tasks, such as kicking and hanging. It has worked great for us every year.

If you guys really dont want to do that, let you second driver be a second pair of eyes, or a coach.

IDK if that idea really works... because when you play games, does that ever happen? One guy moves the player and the other aims and shoots? Our driver was fantastic, when our bot was working fine we got all our balls on our side into the goal. and we has 2 or 3 "coaches", and 1 driver at a time

[MagiChau]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

IDK if that idea really works... because when you play games, does that ever happen? One guy moves the player and the other aims and shoots? Our driver was fantastic, when our bot was working fine we got all our balls on our side into the goal. and we has 2 or 3 "coaches", and 1 driver at a time

Team 85 here does that. One guy does the driving. The other one controls the kicking mechanism and the roller, later arm when we get it working eventually .

[David Brinza]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

That is true, but I always been taught, get in, get out, get the job done and just say good game, nothing more, nothing less. Always know what your job is and your team mate's job. But I guess that does not apply to FIRST then...

FIRST IS different. It's not just about "my job is done here." There's always room for improvement, there are teams who would consider you a guru and thank you for any help you could offer. That separates FIRST from other competitions...big time.

[davidthefat]

Originally Posted by EricH

24 teams make the eliminations. 59 teams are on the team list.That means that 35 teams don't make eliminations, and at least 27 have no chance at all (not high enough of a seed to be a backup robot).

You seeded 20th. This is generally regarded as backup robot territory. As a matter of fact, you were the #6 robot on the backup list (which goes up to 8 robots). This is not the best spot to be in, but at least you have a chance, however slim, of making it into the eliminations.

I have a challenge for you. Instead of focusing on the negative aspects that you observed, find a way to become competitive enough to consistently be in the quarterfinals, or the #1 backup robot. I've looked at your team's history--you've been twice. You've got something that can get you there. You need to cultivate it. (Note: the last time you made it, in 2008, you ran up against 330, 1717, and 980 in quarterfinals while paired with 1538 and 207. There wasn't much anyone could do in that type of situation except fight hard.)

Oh, and try to convince your advisors to sign up for the SCRRF Fall Classic. It's a more low-key post-season event, where you can relax, talk to other teams, and just enjoy the competition. It's also much smaller, giving you more time to interact with other teams and a higher chance of making eliminations.

Do you realize all I remember about your team was your yellow skinny jeans that the girls wore... Back to the topic, I personally want more interaction in the off season, thats where it counts the most in anything, sports and academics.. You don't study like the day before SATs hoping you will ace it, you need to prepare. I agree we need more offseason stuff, I got to tell my teacher that, cause my mentor says the only thing the team does after the regional is a final party at the end of the year and thats it...

[Grim Tuesday]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

IDK if that idea really works... because when you play games, does that ever happen? One guy moves the player and the other aims and shoots? Our driver was fantastic, when our bot was working fine we got all our balls on our side into the goal. and we has 2 or 3 "coaches", and 1 driver at a time

IT works. We were alliance captains, and got knocked out in the semifinals by one point to the winning alliance. This game is not basketball, or soccer. It is FRC.

You also complain about being a poor team: Our school gives almost nothing besides a building and amazing teachers. We get our money from fundraising and sponsors.

From what I have seen that is different from what I know for FIRST. People communicate with other teams beyond good game. For example at West Michigan District in the pit one of our seniors got approached for an autograph by a person from a different team it was a pretty amusing event if you only seen it. It is good to have teams to work on different parts but everyone can get involved with something else. If you are a programmer you could learn to help with some hardware if the code is finished.

This is so true. Our team and team 365 chilled together for quite a while talking and chatting. They ended up beating us in the semifinals, but they ending giving their "moeaward". I still am not sure what that is, but I cant wait to talk with some of their team again. They were all so nice, and it makes me feel proud to be part of a game where teams can be nice, and still compete.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

IDK if that idea really works... because when you play games, does that ever happen? One guy moves the player and the other aims and shoots? Our driver was fantastic, when our bot was working fine we got all our balls on our side into the goal. and we has 2 or 3 "coaches", and 1 driver at a time

Ask Shane, the drive coach on 330 (and the only one who didn't wear the yellow jeans), about that.

For reference, Shane and Elijah, his arm/shooter operator, won 4 regionals, 2 Championship divisions, the Championship, and 1 IRI in 4 years as a drive team. In addition, they picked up 2 regional finalists and 1 IRI finalist.

Yep, it works. It can also take a load off the driver by allowing another person to take some of his duties. The hard part is to have a drive team instead of two drivers. That can only come through practice and trust.

BTW, I was referring to 2008, which was Shane's last year as a driver. There are those who consider him one of the best drivers in FRC.

[davidthefat]

Originally Posted by EricH

Ask Shane, the drive coach on 330, about that.

For reference, Shane and Elijah, his arm/shooter operator, won 4 regionals, 2 Championship divisions, the Championship, and 1 IRI in 4 years as a drive team. In addition, they picked up 2 regional finalists and 1 IRI finalist.

Yep, it works. It can also take a load off the driver by allowing another person to take some of his duties. The hard part is to have a drive team instead of two drivers. That can only come through practice and trust.

We lacked practice, we did not have a defined driver until the day of the competition, we were just lucky our driver we picked was good at what he did... Or we wouldnt even be ranked, Yea Next year there are TONS of things to change about our team

[MagiChau]

Originally Posted by Grim Tuesday

IT works. We were alliance captains, and got knocked out in the semifinals by one point to the winning alliance. This game is not basketball, or soccer. It is FRC.

You also complain about being a poor team: Our school gives almost nothing besides a building and amazing teachers. We get our money from fundraising and sponsors.



This is so true. Our team and team 365 chilled together for quite a while talking and chatting. They ended up beating us in the semifinals, but they ending giving their "moeaward". I still am not sure what that is, but I cant wait to talk with some of their team again. They were all so nice, and it makes me feel proud to be part of a game where teams can be nice, and still compete.

I would say what they gave you is an award for growing. moe means "budding" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moe_%28slang%29

[davidthefat]

LOL Im probably gonna get bashed on by my mentors for treason or something once they find this thread...

[MagiChau]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

LOL Im probably gonna get bashed on by my mentors for treason or something once they find this thread...

You could always fly here to Michigan. We got enough mountain dew for everyone.