Bag and Tag Events List

[Jessica Boucher]

Originally Posted by JamesBrown

I like the Idea of Bag and Tag, the only thing I don't like it that NH and CT are both bag and tag but Boston and WPI are not. I would have liked to see them all the same so teams could easily mix and match. It seems to complicate things a bit if you mix bag and tag and traditional shipping.

We had this same discussion here. I mean, doesn't WPI have confirmed precedent of shuttling in 40 or so teams into Harrington on an annual basis?

[Jon Stratis]

It seems to me that the most cost-effective way of shipping to bag and tag events might involve very little other than organization from FIRST. If a team was coming to 10,000 Lakes from out of state and wanted to ship, for example, it would make a lot of sense to pair them up with a local team attending the regional (for example, 2177 ). They ship their robot to our build space and we stick their crate in a corner. Being FIRST teams, they could trust us to take care of it once in our possession, better than they could the corner of some random warehouse being actively used for other things.

Then, having that local connection, the teams could meet at the build space before the doors open, the robot could be un-crated, and both team's robots stuck in the back of a truck to make the trip together. At the end of the regional, the reverse. The host team would then take the shipping papers and get the robot out to Fed-EX.

This method would be a great way for teams to work together and help each other out, form lasting bonds of friendship across the nation, and save FIRST a lot of headaches/money. They would just need a way for teams to volunteer to host and other teams to ask for volunteers. The teams could do the rest of the arrangements. At least, this would solve the worries Dale listed

[Bob Steele]

Originally Posted by eagle33199

It seems to me that the most cost-effective way of shipping to bag and tag events might involve very little other than organization from FIRST. If a team was coming to 10,000 Lakes from out of state and wanted to ship, for example, it would make a lot of sense to pair them up with a local team attending the regional (for example, 2177 ). They ship their robot to our build space and we stick their crate in a corner. Being FIRST teams, they could trust us to take care of it once in our possession, better than they could the corner of some random warehouse being actively used for other things.

Then, having that local connection, the teams could meet at the build space before the doors open, the robot could be un-crated, and both team's robots stuck in the back of a truck to make the trip together. At the end of the regional, the reverse. The host team would then take the shipping papers and get the robot out to Fed-EX.

This method would be a great way for teams to work together and help each other out, form lasting bonds of friendship across the nation, and save FIRST a lot of headaches/money. They would just need a way for teams to volunteer to host and other teams to ask for volunteers. The teams could do the rest of the arrangements. At least, this would solve the worries Dale listed

This is a great idea. I would certainly be in favor of it!! If it works out and any distant team wants to come to Seattle we would be happy to do this for them.

My only question is whether the robot needs to be bagged inside the crate? To satisfy the intent of the rule I would expect that there would have to be some accounting of how long the robot was OUT OF THE BAG before crating... the easiest thing would be to just put the bagged robot in the crate.

??

R

[Jon Stratis]

According to the rules from last year (specifically section 4.8.2.2), where you attend a traditional regional followed by a bag and tag regional, you bag the robot at the end of the first regional, and then ship the bagged robot back to your workspace/school/wherever your team will be receiving it. This way, there is no ambiguity around how long the robot was out of the bag after shipping.

I would expect this to be no different. If you ship to a bag and tag regional, you will likely have to have the robot in the bag while in its crate being shipped. I highly doubt FIRST will overlook this in the rules... it's a fairly obvious situation, with them arranging shipping to bag and tag events for some teams.

[RoboMom]

Gosh, this is confusing.
Chesapeake and DC are back-to-back. One is NBAT (Not BAT, or is there an official term?), the other BAT.
The past two years the local folks have tried to help negotiate reduced shipping between these venues 35 miles apart.
Lots of teams with questions and hope there is some guidance before Sept. 30. Shipping costs are always one of the decision points in choosing an event.

[JesseK]

Hopefully this is simply a year of transition for shipping; it's one of those changes to the fundamental way we've done something 'forever', is painful to change, but is quite necessary from many perspectives. Like bumpers. Hopefully next year there will be more regional continuity, or at least an established and efficient way to go between BAT and NBAT.

[buildmaster5000]

Originally Posted by RoboMom

Gosh, this is confusing.
Chesapeake and DC are back-to-back. One is NBAT (Not BAT, or is there an official term?), the other BAT.
The past two years the local folks have tried to help negotiate reduced shipping between these venues 35 miles apart.
Lots of teams with questions and hope there is some guidance before Sept. 30. Shipping costs are always one of the decision points in choosing an event.

Seeing that DC, VA and chesapeake are all not back to back to back like last year, is a good thing. I believe that you can bag your robot at Chesapeake, and bring it to DC in a truck. That should reduce shipping costs (If FedEx is still a sponsor, it should be free) so you can do two regionals.

[Aren Siekmeier]

Originally Posted by RoboMom

Lots of teams with questions and hope there is some guidance before Sept. 30. Shipping costs are always one of the decision points in choosing an event.

The last email blast had some hopeful implications of team support just before registration opens.

Extended Team Support Hours: In order to better assist teams during initial registration, Team Support representatives will be available at 1-800-871-8326 ext. 0.until 8 PM EST on 9/27-9/29.

Since this is before registration opens on the 30th, hopefully any teams that have big potential problems with shipping can get things worked out before registration opens.

edit: see this thread: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...threadid=86936

[Chris is me]

So if I'm going crate -> bag for an event, I have to ship a bagged robot to some location, take the bagged robot out, and bring it bagged to that event? I can't just take it?

That's really dumb. What cost savings is there in that?

[Jon Stratis]

Chris -

The "official" position has always been that everything ships. You ship to your first event, from your first to your second, from second to championship, from championship home (for example). It's been possible to get exceptions in the past - if you don't qualify for championship, for instance, you could get an exception and take your robot+crate home with you from your last event of the season. (Section 4.5.9 of the 2010 manual)

Hopefully, with the dramatic increase in bag and tag events, and the huge likelihood that a large number of teams will be attending both BAT and traditional events, they'll change the way the exception process works. Yes, you need to ship to traditional events, but they should allow exceptions if its your last event OR if your next event is bag and tag.

It would cut down on shipping costs, and probably make things easier for the teams.

[Chris is me]

Ah. If exceptions will be given out for that sort of thing I'll be okay with it. My team has the potential to be "right on the bubble" funding wise between one and two events this year, and if we could save on shipping by bagging to CT or Waterloo we would probably do either event second after WPI.

[Jon Stratis]

Keep your fingers crossed The only question is... when will teams know when the shipping/bagging requirements are this year? I imagine, with the economy the way it is, there are a lot of teams in your position - maybe not quite able to attend a second event, and saving money on shipping would allow them that opportunity... But they would have to know before the events they want to attend fill up.

Of course, my previous post was pure speculation and wishful thinking... FIRST could decide not to change the rules at all and make you ship home from that first traditional event (section 4.8.2.2 in the 2010 manual).

[RoboMom]

New NEMO resource paper on Bag and Tag Tips. These hints may be helpful, but teams need to monitor updates in official game manual for 2011.
http://www.firstnemo.org/resources.htm

[KathieK]

Save the Date!
Senior Mentor Call 12/9 @ 7 PM EST: The next Senior Mentor call will take place on Thursday, December 9th @ 7 PM. The call topic is Bag and Tag Best Practices, and the call will be hosted by Kathie Kentfield, FIRST Senior Mentor; and Frank Merrick, Deputy Director, FRC. A call outline, as well as call-in information is available here: http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr....aspx?id=10124

[onecoolc]

Originally Posted by Bob Steele

This is a great idea. I would certainly be in favor of it!! If it works out and any distant team wants to come to Seattle we would be happy to do this for them.

Oh, our team may or may not need to take you (or another team) up on that, actually. We're coming into Seattle for Olympic from Idaho. We've never done a BAT event before, and it's our only regional this year. I don't know how the team/our Coach will decide to to handle this whole thing yet, of course. I guess a lot of it depends on the stance FIRST takes, and what sort of procedures or help they'll be putting into place.