2007 in relation to 2011

[WhiteShadow1474]

Originally Posted by 340x4xLife

You score in front of your own drivers station, blocking your own vision.

It kind of is a hard thing to think about. When you score, should you score on yourself, or in front of your alliance Who know you had to be graciously professional to your own teammates!

[The Lucas]

Originally Posted by ZonChau

And your robot doesn't necessarily need to be able to pick up tubes from the ground.

In 07 there was a (infrequently used) Loading Slot, where the Human Player could feed a tube to a bot. The only difference was the slot was in a vertical orientation as opposed to the horizontal orientation this year.

[Josh Fox]

Which makes it exponentially easier to human load through the given slot this year than 2007 IMO. Though somehow certain teams found ways to human load without using it...

[spiffyspleen]

Okay, I think people got a little bit off track. If you read the original thread, you would know that I didn't want this to be a discussion of every minute difference between the 2011 and 2007 games. I was looking for tube manipulator designs that worked well. One guy at the begining had the right idea with a link about 2007 bots. That guy is awesome, I really don't care about the rest of you.

[Josh Fox]

While it's entirely possible that we did get off track, I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss everyone aside from the "one guy at the beginning." There's good lessons to be learned.

If you have the chance, I recommend trying to track down a copy of the 2007 FIRST Behind the Design book.

Also, here's a few teams that I'd recommend checking out from that year. There are many many other very successful teams, but these are some that I remember the best.
71
111
233
469

And also, the videos from Einstein that year.

[spiffyspleen]

Thank You! And sorry if I came off a little harsh, it's been a long day...

[Nawaid Ladak]

the FIRST Behind the Design book people are talking about can be found on Google books for a free quick glancethrough

This was exactly the first thing that popped into my head when i saw this years game.

[Visualart]

yes you do score in front of yourself. but if you score in the high positions, you do not block vision (especially if your drive team is short)...

[Ian Curtis]

Not every robot needs a change to fit in under 60".

And, elevators don't need to be complicated, a 2x4, a cut up belt, and a pulley are all you need to get started.

[Erik Huang]

Originally Posted by lineskier

in 07 most of the best robots went for the bottom and occasionally the middle wrung, rarely the top.

in 11 the top wrung is worth 3x the bottom wrung, also autonomous scoring has different values for each wrung. I expect to see many more top hangers this year.

don't forget, the scoring on the middle row will obstruct your view; making the bottom row hard to score on. the top row, although valuable, will be hard to get, especially with a good defensive robot against you.

[Erik Huang]

i believe you block your own, since your human player is across the field (not with you)

[KrakatoaCoo]

I immediately thought of Rack 'n' Roll when I saw the field at Kick-off.

[Bob Steele]

Mechanically the rack has another big difference.

The plates which terminate the scoring rods are MUCH smaller than the big 5" plates in the 2007 game
They are 2.75 inch diameter disks.

It will be quite a bit easier to bump a tube off by mistake.... and if you expect to place a tube by pulling back and reacting with the plate (as many teams did in 2007) ... you will pull the tube right over that small plate. (It's radius is only 1 3/8") not much for the tube to react against.

Tubes will have to be dropped on to the rods... and then the mechanism will have to be removed with great finess...

Another big difference is the direction of scoring. MOST scoring in 2007 was done directly in front of the driver's station ...and the tubes were loaded from the same direction...

This year.... long field... tubes enter the field from entire opposite end of field.

Definite similarities but large, subtle and not so subtle differences in game play.

I think the game dynamics will be quite a bit different...I can see robots that are scorers playing defense while a team mate shuttles the objects to them...

last 30 seconds or so will be dominated by minibots... so relatively short 1:30 time to put tubes up...

I like the mix of autonomous points and a later effect from autonomous...in points...

auto is BIG deal...good autos will win these games...at least at St. Louis

Autonomous in 2007 was marginal... fun to watch... but really didn't make much of a difference in the end...

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by Bob Steele

Mechanically the rack has another big difference.

The plates which terminate the scoring rods are MUCH smaller than the big 5" plates in the 2007 game
They are 2.75 inch diameter disks.

It will be quite a bit easier to bump a tube off by mistake.... and if you expect to place a tube by pulling back and reacting with the plate (as many teams did in 2007) ... you will pull the tube right over that small plate. (It's radius is only 1 3/8") not much for the tube to react against.

No STINGER, either (that little black rubber piece).

Also, in 2007 the plates were mounted so the PVC rod was at the bottom. Are they mounted the same way this year, or are they centered on the rod?

[vhcook]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

No STINGER, either (that little black rubber piece).

Also, in 2007 the plates were mounted so the PVC rod was at the bottom. Are they mounted the same way this year, or are they centered on the rod?

They are mounted the same way. The drawings show that the endcap edge is tangent to the horizontal rod at the bottom.