pic: New low bar flaps

[Jon Stratis]

Originally Posted by JohnSchneider

This is a joke. The bar is an entirely different obstacle now. Shouldn't have rolled this out till next week so teams had time to prepare...

Seeing as FIRST basically had no low bar flaps left after week 1, no matter what they did it would have been "an entirely different obstacle". This seems like the closest they could get to the former behavior on their tight schedule.

[MrBasse]

That's definitely not the most attractive solution I've seen to a problem. How fast and easily do they get pushed sideways and get hung up on the zip ties on the bar?

[SharonO]

Unless something changes in the morning, Kansas City was still using regular low bar coverings, except they are made from red and blue bumper material.

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by SharonO

Unless something changes in the morning, Kansas City was still using regular low bar coverings, except they are made from red and blue bumper material.

Oh boy, now we have drastic inconsistencies across events!

Hopefully Kansas City switches to the new method for the actual matches.

[CalTran]

Originally Posted by SharonO

Unless something changes in the morning, Kansas City was still using regular low bar coverings, except they are made from red and blue bumper material.

Originally Posted by nighterfighter

Oh boy, now we have drastic inconsistencies across events!

Hopefully Kansas City switches to the new method for the actual matches.

Originally Posted by Team Update 15

This solution will be implemented at most events, assuming shipments are on time.

Apparently KC regional doesn't qualify for "most" events status. I asked Tyler, the head ref, this morning and he pointed out the operative word "most" in the update.

[Alex Cormier]

Originally Posted by CalTran

Apparently KC regional doesn't qualify for "most" events status. I asked Tyler, the head ref, this morning and he pointed out the operative word "most" in the update.

It's also due to shipments. The places close to carr warehouses and all will get them first than others.

[dmorewood]

Has anyone actively tried to get a boulder through this? I know it's "technically" illegal but if someone can get the ball through the gaps after they've potentially been disrupted and moved by a robot isn't that more of just a poor design by the GDC then a foul or illegal movement of a boulder by a team.

[Jacob Bendicksen]

Originally Posted by dmorewood

Has anyone actively tried to get a boulder through this? I know it's "technically" illegal but if someone can get the ball through the gaps after they've potentially been disrupted and moved by a robot isn't that more of just a poor design by the GDC then a foul or illegal movement of a boulder by a team.

Some of the volunteers at Wilsonville were trying to do this while teams were connecting to the field...they didn't manage to get one all the way through, but one boulder made it to the other side of the low bar, held in place by one of the flaps. Definitely not impossible.

I was also playing around with one of the low bars -- as a result of the rubbery material the flaps are made of, it's close to impossible to get it to swing all the way around the bar as the fabric did. I couldn't tell exactly how much room it was taking up, but I think it was about half an inch under the low bar, so some teams that are close to 14" could have a little unexpected fun this weekend getting through.

[klink135]

It seems the new strips are ziptied to each other, so they all move as one, so it shouldn't be too much of an entanglement problem.

[Rebecca Pelzer]

Originally Posted by klink135

It seems the new strips are ziptied to each other, so they all move as one, so it shouldn't be too much of an entanglement problem.

Unless it's just us, they aren't. There are zipties on either side of the flaps to hold them in place on the bar and then another pair attached to each flap itself so they don't fly off the bar. (Since it's just a piece of the vinyl draped over the bar)

As per flipping them around (not your post, but it's early so I really don't want to go back and quote theirs too!), it hasn't seemed like too much of an issue here in Arkansas. That might not be true today or in other places, but it does appear that the flaps fling outward just so that it lets robots through fairly easily.

[Nathan Streeter]

Thanks for sharing the picture!

Hopefully this'll work alright...

[Rebecca Pelzer]

Originally Posted by MrBasse

That's definitely not the most attractive solution I've seen to a problem. How fast and easily do they get pushed sideways and get hung up on the zip ties on the bar?

Not so much the flaps themselves, but the zipties at the top (around the low bar itself, holding them in place), get pushed out of place at least every two matches.

Everyone that I've seen go under the lowbar (so far) has seemingly gone under it the same as they would with the normal flap.

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

Seeing as FIRST basically had no low bar flaps left after week 1, no matter what they did it would have been "an entirely different obstacle". This seems like the closest they could get to the former behavior on their tight schedule.

I don't know, using bumper fabric for low bars didn't make the obstacle entirely different, except for the part where bumper fabric was far less prone to ripping apart. If anything buying a few yards of fabric seems easier for most events to do than getting strips of vinyl cut and zip tied together. I really don't get why FIRST went this route.

I'm especially troubled by the early reports that this vinyl makes the low bar effectively shorter. Making the biggest design constraint in this game even tougher, long after we're finished with our robots, instead of "just" buying tougher fabric? For once I'm glad I competed Week 1 and not Week 2!

[jlmcmchl]

FWIW, the material is surprisingly heavy as a curtain, and is just as effective as the previous style of low bar for preventing balls from passing.

[Sunshine]

Watching the live feeds, it looks like individual flaps can enter the robot? Can anyone at an event verify this? If true, and if the height has truly been shortened, FIRST has dropped the ball on this one. I can see the need for a remedy but the characteristics need to be identical. This is the best engineers can come up with?