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Unread 03-12-2018, 06:24 PM
truell20 truell20 is offline
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Games Where Vault Mattered

Links to games where the vault decided the match?
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Unread 03-12-2018, 07:33 PM
RoboAlum RoboAlum is offline
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

That's hard to say because the vault hasn't really been used to it's fullest potential for strategic value.
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Unread 03-12-2018, 07:46 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

The power-ups have more strategic power in tight matches then I initially anticipated. Here's one example from last weekend where the vault made the difference.

https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2018flor_sf2m2

https://youtu.be/42Jseh2wMh8
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Unread 03-12-2018, 07:57 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

One of my personal favorite matches. Our alliance had no scale ability, however was able to win the match due to efficient use of the vault, and by owning both switches for the majority of matches.
https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2018inmis_qm61


In our first quarter finals match, we lost the match due to inefficient use of the vault.
https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2018inmis_qf3m1


From what I saw at our first competition, the vault is a very important aspect of this game.
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Unread 03-12-2018, 08:07 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Heartland Alliance #3 made excellent use of their Vault with masterful timing of their Boost powerup.
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Unread 03-12-2018, 08:10 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by truell20 View Post
Links to games where the vault decided the match?
Here are some matches where vault points made a win/lose difference, if that's what you were asking:

Code:
Match		bs	rs	bv	rv	bs-bv	rs-rv
2018arli_qm92	261	259	45	20	216	239
2018arli_sf1m1	343	341	45	30	298	311
2018azfl_qm3	114	96	45	0	69	96
2018azfl_qm6	259	259	0	5	259	254
2018azfl_qm53	223	244	15	45	208	199
2018azfl_qm75	259	264	20	30	239	234
2018casd_qm17	294	304	10	30	284	274
2018ctwat_qm34	309	325	25	45	284	280
2018flor_qm8	158	161	5	15	153	146
2018flor_qm36	261	260	40	0	221	260
2018flor_sf2m2	348	349	30	45	318	304
2018gadal_qm24	226	243	15	35	211	208
2018gadal_qm41	202	188	25	10	177	178
2018gagai_qm80	191	202	5	25	186	177
2018gagai_sf2m2	241	240	15	0	226	240
2018gush_qm25	209	192	30	0	179	192
2018inmis_qm56	334	368	0	45	334	323
2018inmis_qm68	318	323	25	45	293	278
2018inmis_qm72	344	355	20	40	324	315
2018isde1_qf4m1	296	292	40	25	256	267
2018isde1_qm7	241	253	10	30	231	223
2018isde1_qm62	202	180	40	0	162	180
2018isde2_qm5	299	299	30	5	269	294
2018mawor_f1m2	358	350	45	30	313	320
2018mawor_qm60	220	243	15	40	205	203
2018mawor_qm81	228	259	5	45	223	214
2018micen_qm13	67	61	20	10	47	51
2018migib_qf2m1	283	285	35	45	248	240
2018migib_qm22	252	263	15	45	237	218
2018migib_qm56	257	249	45	30	212	219
2018migib_qm59	338	319	45	20	293	299
2018mike2_qm40	343	347	5	40	338	307
2018mike2_qm58	300	281	30	10	270	271
2018miket_qm49	231	216	30	10	201	206
2018miket_qm60	254	260	15	30	239	230
2018miket_qm66	268	272	15	25	253	247
2018misjo_qm55	260	278	5	25	255	253
2018misjo_qm68	292	299	0	45	292	254
2018misou_qm44	282	301	15	35	267	266
2018mitvc_f1m3	301	305	25	30	276	275
2018mitvc_qm37	282	277	25	15	257	262
2018mitvc_qm65	258	272	20	35	238	237
2018mitvc_qm73	241	257	0	20	241	237
2018miwat_qm27	270	257	40	20	230	237
2018miwat_qm40	285	282	20	15	265	267
2018miwat_qm56	295	265	40	0	255	265
2018miwat_qm67	289	309	15	40	274	269
2018miwat_qm68	293	275	40	5	253	270
2018mndu_qf4m2	318	324	25	40	293	284
2018mndu_qm21	150	156	5	35	145	121
2018mndu_qm22	294	307	15	35	279	272
2018mndu2_qm61	280	279	20	15	260	264
2018mokc2_f1m1	314	286	45	15	269	271
2018mokc2_qm54	314	326	25	40	289	286
2018mosl_qm5	302	282	35	5	267	277
2018mosl_qm10	241	236	25	0	216	236
2018mosl_qm17	285	324	0	40	285	284
2018mosl_qm21	246	251	0	20	246	231
2018mosl_qm29	306	286	40	10	266	276
2018mosl_qm69	334	315	40	20	294	295
2018mxmo_qm27	238	221	30	5	208	216
2018mxmo_qm41	165	157	20	0	145	157
2018mxmo_qm88	283	264	35	15	248	249
2018ncgre_qm42	314	323	15	30	299	293
2018ndgf_qm2	240	241	5	10	235	231
2018ndgf_qm6	279	282	20	30	259	252
2018ndgf_qm45	377	377	15	40	362	337
2018njfla_qf3m2	369	376	20	45	349	331
2018nyut_qm19	296	300	25	45	271	255
2018ohmv_qm3	292	312	15	45	277	267
2018ohmv_qm55	276	268	40	10	236	258
2018ohmv_qm70	253	231	30	0	223	231
2018onbar_qf1m1	262	262	20	5	242	257
2018onbar_qm54	263	301	0	40	263	261
2018orwil_qf3m2	269	260	45	15	224	245
2018orwil_qm8	265	256	15	0	250	256
2018orwil_qm31	208	195	35	5	173	190
2018pawch_qf3m2	311	297	35	15	276	282
2018pawch_qf3m3	272	274	25	35	247	239
2018pawch_qm3	325	320	35	25	290	295
2018pawch_qm16	306	283	30	5	276	278
2018pawch_qm52	269	256	20	0	249	256
2018pawch_sf1m2	312	306	30	15	282	291
2018qcmo_qm79	382	382	15	45	367	337
2018txda_qm39	66	91	5	35	61	56
2018utwv_qf2m2	324	305	40	20	284	285
2018utwv_qm5	258	257	20	15	238	242
2018utwv_qm59	258	251	45	5	213	246
2018vagdc_qm1	220	220	0	5	220	215
2018vagle_qm60	304	284	45	10	259	274
2018vahay_qm24	184	185	5	25	179	160
2018vahay_qm61	294	298	30	40	264	258
2018wamou_qf2m1	301	284	40	15	261	269
2018wamou_qm1	190	203	0	20	190	183
2018wamou_qm44	226	250	0	25	226	225
2018wamou_qm68	278	262	45	5	233	257
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Unread 03-12-2018, 08:18 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Here are some matches where vault points made a win/lose difference, if that's what you were asking:
A. Opinions
B. Hypotheses
C. Anecdotes
D. Data

One of these things is not like the others ....

----

BTW -- MISJO Q68 was one of my personal favorite matches. Stryke Force jumps out to an early lead on the scale and holds it for most of the match, while 2474 patiently plugs away to get it balanced. Meanwhile, 5501 is calmly stuffing the exchange. They play power ups intelligently, and swing the match in the final seconds. Very cool. Tortoise steals one from the hare.

I took a snack break to watch this one. You can see me in an inspector's hat, bottom left of the screen.
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Last edited by Richard Wallace : 03-12-2018 at 08:38 PM.
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Unread 03-12-2018, 09:13 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by CalTran View Post
Heartland Alliance #3 made excellent use of their Vault with masterful timing of their Boost powerup.
Indeed. Finals 1 was won off of the vault; blue alliance got an extra 38 points off of the vault and power ups (not including force points) giving them the victory. Without penalties and these bonuses the score would have been 286-276 red victory.

It is interesting to note that red had 212 ownership points to blue's 152 and blue came out way on top. For the first time in a while, brute strength and points does not mean a victory...

https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2018mokc2_f1m1
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Unread 03-12-2018, 11:36 PM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

A little hint: The VAULT matters IF the other allince owns their switch AND you prevent them from owning the scale for 97 seconds or more THEN Vault matters a lot.
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Unread 03-13-2018, 08:34 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post

BTW -- MISJO Q68 was one of my personal favorite matches. Stryke Force jumps out to an early lead on the scale and holds it for most of the match, while 2474 patiently plugs away to get it balanced. Meanwhile, 5501 is calmly stuffing the exchange. They play power ups intelligently, and swing the match in the final seconds. Very cool. Tortoise steals one from the hare.

I took a snack break to watch this one. You can see me in an inspector's hat, bottom left of the screen.
Awesome match, and awesome example of how important the vault really is, strategically. It seems stryke force thought they had the match in the bag and sat on the platform for just about a full minute of the match (that, or they broke something and couldn't be of use to their alliance anymore).

Another thing to note (though it wouldn't quite swing the match), is that there was a missed G22 violation early in the match when 5501 pushed a cube into the exchange while in possession of another cube. That foul would have made the difference 2 points. This game is quite tricky for refs...
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Unread 03-13-2018, 09:37 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Here are some matches where vault points made a win/lose difference, if that's what you were asking:

Code:
Match		bs	rs	bv	rv	bs-bv	rs-rv
2018arli_qm92	261	259	45	20	216	239
2018arli_sf1m1	343	341	45	30	298	311
2018azfl_qm3	114	96	45	0	69	96
2018azfl_qm6	259	259	0	5	259	254
2018azfl_qm53	223	244	15	45	208	199
2018azfl_qm75	259	264	20	30	239	234
2018casd_qm17	294	304	10	30	284	274
2018ctwat_qm34	309	325	25	45	284	280
2018flor_qm8	158	161	5	15	153	146
2018flor_qm36	261	260	40	0	221	260
2018flor_sf2m2	348	349	30	45	318	304
2018gadal_qm24	226	243	15	35	211	208
2018gadal_qm41	202	188	25	10	177	178
2018gagai_qm80	191	202	5	25	186	177
2018gagai_sf2m2	241	240	15	0	226	240
2018gush_qm25	209	192	30	0	179	192
2018inmis_qm56	334	368	0	45	334	323
2018inmis_qm68	318	323	25	45	293	278
2018inmis_qm72	344	355	20	40	324	315
2018isde1_qf4m1	296	292	40	25	256	267
2018isde1_qm7	241	253	10	30	231	223
2018isde1_qm62	202	180	40	0	162	180
2018isde2_qm5	299	299	30	5	269	294
2018mawor_f1m2	358	350	45	30	313	320
2018mawor_qm60	220	243	15	40	205	203
2018mawor_qm81	228	259	5	45	223	214
2018micen_qm13	67	61	20	10	47	51
2018migib_qf2m1	283	285	35	45	248	240
2018migib_qm22	252	263	15	45	237	218
2018migib_qm56	257	249	45	30	212	219
2018migib_qm59	338	319	45	20	293	299
2018mike2_qm40	343	347	5	40	338	307
2018mike2_qm58	300	281	30	10	270	271
2018miket_qm49	231	216	30	10	201	206
2018miket_qm60	254	260	15	30	239	230
2018miket_qm66	268	272	15	25	253	247
2018misjo_qm55	260	278	5	25	255	253
2018misjo_qm68	292	299	0	45	292	254
2018misou_qm44	282	301	15	35	267	266
2018mitvc_f1m3	301	305	25	30	276	275
2018mitvc_qm37	282	277	25	15	257	262
2018mitvc_qm65	258	272	20	35	238	237
2018mitvc_qm73	241	257	0	20	241	237
2018miwat_qm27	270	257	40	20	230	237
2018miwat_qm40	285	282	20	15	265	267
2018miwat_qm56	295	265	40	0	255	265
2018miwat_qm67	289	309	15	40	274	269
2018miwat_qm68	293	275	40	5	253	270
2018mndu_qf4m2	318	324	25	40	293	284
2018mndu_qm21	150	156	5	35	145	121
2018mndu_qm22	294	307	15	35	279	272
2018mndu2_qm61	280	279	20	15	260	264
2018mokc2_f1m1	314	286	45	15	269	271
2018mokc2_qm54	314	326	25	40	289	286
2018mosl_qm5	302	282	35	5	267	277
2018mosl_qm10	241	236	25	0	216	236
2018mosl_qm17	285	324	0	40	285	284
2018mosl_qm21	246	251	0	20	246	231
2018mosl_qm29	306	286	40	10	266	276
2018mosl_qm69	334	315	40	20	294	295
2018mxmo_qm27	238	221	30	5	208	216
2018mxmo_qm41	165	157	20	0	145	157
2018mxmo_qm88	283	264	35	15	248	249
2018ncgre_qm42	314	323	15	30	299	293
2018ndgf_qm2	240	241	5	10	235	231
2018ndgf_qm6	279	282	20	30	259	252
2018ndgf_qm45	377	377	15	40	362	337
2018njfla_qf3m2	369	376	20	45	349	331
2018nyut_qm19	296	300	25	45	271	255
2018ohmv_qm3	292	312	15	45	277	267
2018ohmv_qm55	276	268	40	10	236	258
2018ohmv_qm70	253	231	30	0	223	231
2018onbar_qf1m1	262	262	20	5	242	257
2018onbar_qm54	263	301	0	40	263	261
2018orwil_qf3m2	269	260	45	15	224	245
2018orwil_qm8	265	256	15	0	250	256
2018orwil_qm31	208	195	35	5	173	190
2018pawch_qf3m2	311	297	35	15	276	282
2018pawch_qf3m3	272	274	25	35	247	239
2018pawch_qm3	325	320	35	25	290	295
2018pawch_qm16	306	283	30	5	276	278
2018pawch_qm52	269	256	20	0	249	256
2018pawch_sf1m2	312	306	30	15	282	291
2018qcmo_qm79	382	382	15	45	367	337
2018txda_qm39	66	91	5	35	61	56
2018utwv_qf2m2	324	305	40	20	284	285
2018utwv_qm5	258	257	20	15	238	242
2018utwv_qm59	258	251	45	5	213	246
2018vagdc_qm1	220	220	0	5	220	215
2018vagle_qm60	304	284	45	10	259	274
2018vahay_qm24	184	185	5	25	179	160
2018vahay_qm61	294	298	30	40	264	258
2018wamou_qf2m1	301	284	40	15	261	269
2018wamou_qm1	190	203	0	20	190	183
2018wamou_qm44	226	250	0	25	226	225
2018wamou_qm68	278	262	45	5	233	257
Great data... is there any way to include points gained from Boost/Force as well? I would think including those would add a number of other matches as well.
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Unread 03-13-2018, 10:41 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Waterbury Q4M2 saw the red alliance lose by 10 points with two cubes sitting next to the vault (already in the exchange, just not placed in the vault) at the T=0.
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Unread 03-13-2018, 10:59 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Here are some matches where vault points made a win/lose difference, if that's what you were asking:

Code:
Match		bs	rs	bv	rv	bs-bv	rs-rv
2018arli_qm92	261	259	45	20	216	239
2018arli_sf1m1	343	341	45	30	298	311
2018azfl_qm3	114	96	45	0	69	96
2018azfl_qm6	259	259	0	5	259	254
2018azfl_qm53	223	244	15	45	208	199
2018azfl_qm75	259	264	20	30	239	234
2018casd_qm17	294	304	10	30	284	274
2018ctwat_qm34	309	325	25	45	284	280
2018flor_qm8	158	161	5	15	153	146
2018flor_qm36	261	260	40	0	221	260
2018flor_sf2m2	348	349	30	45	318	304
2018gadal_qm24	226	243	15	35	211	208
2018gadal_qm41	202	188	25	10	177	178
2018gagai_qm80	191	202	5	25	186	177
2018gagai_sf2m2	241	240	15	0	226	240
2018gush_qm25	209	192	30	0	179	192
2018inmis_qm56	334	368	0	45	334	323
2018inmis_qm68	318	323	25	45	293	278
2018inmis_qm72	344	355	20	40	324	315
2018isde1_qf4m1	296	292	40	25	256	267
2018isde1_qm7	241	253	10	30	231	223
2018isde1_qm62	202	180	40	0	162	180
2018isde2_qm5	299	299	30	5	269	294
2018mawor_f1m2	358	350	45	30	313	320
2018mawor_qm60	220	243	15	40	205	203
2018mawor_qm81	228	259	5	45	223	214
2018micen_qm13	67	61	20	10	47	51
2018migib_qf2m1	283	285	35	45	248	240
2018migib_qm22	252	263	15	45	237	218
2018migib_qm56	257	249	45	30	212	219
2018migib_qm59	338	319	45	20	293	299
2018mike2_qm40	343	347	5	40	338	307
2018mike2_qm58	300	281	30	10	270	271
2018miket_qm49	231	216	30	10	201	206
2018miket_qm60	254	260	15	30	239	230
2018miket_qm66	268	272	15	25	253	247
2018misjo_qm55	260	278	5	25	255	253
2018misjo_qm68	292	299	0	45	292	254
2018misou_qm44	282	301	15	35	267	266
2018mitvc_f1m3	301	305	25	30	276	275
2018mitvc_qm37	282	277	25	15	257	262
2018mitvc_qm65	258	272	20	35	238	237
2018mitvc_qm73	241	257	0	20	241	237
2018miwat_qm27	270	257	40	20	230	237
2018miwat_qm40	285	282	20	15	265	267
2018miwat_qm56	295	265	40	0	255	265
2018miwat_qm67	289	309	15	40	274	269
2018miwat_qm68	293	275	40	5	253	270
2018mndu_qf4m2	318	324	25	40	293	284
2018mndu_qm21	150	156	5	35	145	121
2018mndu_qm22	294	307	15	35	279	272
2018mndu2_qm61	280	279	20	15	260	264
2018mokc2_f1m1	314	286	45	15	269	271
2018mokc2_qm54	314	326	25	40	289	286
2018mosl_qm5	302	282	35	5	267	277
2018mosl_qm10	241	236	25	0	216	236
2018mosl_qm17	285	324	0	40	285	284
2018mosl_qm21	246	251	0	20	246	231
2018mosl_qm29	306	286	40	10	266	276
2018mosl_qm69	334	315	40	20	294	295
2018mxmo_qm27	238	221	30	5	208	216
2018mxmo_qm41	165	157	20	0	145	157
2018mxmo_qm88	283	264	35	15	248	249
2018ncgre_qm42	314	323	15	30	299	293
2018ndgf_qm2	240	241	5	10	235	231
2018ndgf_qm6	279	282	20	30	259	252
2018ndgf_qm45	377	377	15	40	362	337
2018njfla_qf3m2	369	376	20	45	349	331
2018nyut_qm19	296	300	25	45	271	255
2018ohmv_qm3	292	312	15	45	277	267
2018ohmv_qm55	276	268	40	10	236	258
2018ohmv_qm70	253	231	30	0	223	231
2018onbar_qf1m1	262	262	20	5	242	257
2018onbar_qm54	263	301	0	40	263	261
2018orwil_qf3m2	269	260	45	15	224	245
2018orwil_qm8	265	256	15	0	250	256
2018orwil_qm31	208	195	35	5	173	190
2018pawch_qf3m2	311	297	35	15	276	282
2018pawch_qf3m3	272	274	25	35	247	239
2018pawch_qm3	325	320	35	25	290	295
2018pawch_qm16	306	283	30	5	276	278
2018pawch_qm52	269	256	20	0	249	256
2018pawch_sf1m2	312	306	30	15	282	291
2018qcmo_qm79	382	382	15	45	367	337
2018txda_qm39	66	91	5	35	61	56
2018utwv_qf2m2	324	305	40	20	284	285
2018utwv_qm5	258	257	20	15	238	242
2018utwv_qm59	258	251	45	5	213	246
2018vagdc_qm1	220	220	0	5	220	215
2018vagle_qm60	304	284	45	10	259	274
2018vahay_qm24	184	185	5	25	179	160
2018vahay_qm61	294	298	30	40	264	258
2018wamou_qf2m1	301	284	40	15	261	269
2018wamou_qm1	190	203	0	20	190	183
2018wamou_qm44	226	250	0	25	226	225
2018wamou_qm68	278	262	45	5	233	257
Does this include information from all ~4,600 matches played?
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Unread 03-13-2018, 11:30 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesCH95 View Post
Does this include information from all ~4,600 matches played?
Using all 4347 matches
extracted from this spreadsheet
containing all TBA match scoring data
from all Events completed
by the end of 03/11/18

4347 total matches, 46 events, 1928 teams

3633 qual matches
0411 quarterfinal matches
0203 semifinal matches
0100 final matches


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Unread 03-13-2018, 11:40 AM
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Re: Games Where Vault Mattered

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Using all 4347 matches
extracted from this spreadsheet
containing all TBA match scoring data
from all Events completed
by the end of 03/11/18

4347 total matches, 46 events, 1928 teams

3633 qual matches
0411 quarterfinal matches
0203 semifinal matches
0100 final matches


To talk round numbers: 100 of 4300 decided by vault points. or roughly 2%.
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