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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:15 AM
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Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

Does anyone experience not being able to see their robot because a field element gets in the way during competition? If so, how often and does it inhibit your team's performance at all?

Please take this survey to answer these questions:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/YW88KYH

Thank you
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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:19 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

Interesting set of questions... what are you hoping to see with this data and what are your plans for the results?
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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:19 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

I would recommend adding another question to highlight what year had the issue. I can guarantee that everyone has had some viability issue in the last 4 years.
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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:41 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

The answer is yes, visibility is an issue in some games. Unless you're limiting your playing area significantly, you'll run into this - which means everyone has run into it. That's part of the challenge of the game design that teams need to overcome. I'm interested to know what you're trying to show/affect with this survey.
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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:48 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

This is why I place Steamworks below Recycle Rush in my compendium of most enjoyed games. It was a major turnoff when, as a spectator, one could not see a good percentage of critical robot gameplay.
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Unread 11-01-2018, 11:50 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

2015, 2016, 2017, and 2018 have all had significant visibility issues. I find it hard to imagine any driver or coach from those years saying that they have never had a problem with not being able to see the robot. And unless you're driving the robot virtually (i.e. not by sight), that is bound to inhibit your team's performance.

I imagine this survey is preceding either some kind of product release or a petition for FIRST to get rid of tall field-elements. I'll reserve judgement until that comes out.
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Unread 11-01-2018, 12:29 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

Quote:
Originally Posted by AriMB View Post
2015, 2016, 2017, and 2018 have all had significant visibility issues.
2015? I operated and had no issues with seeing our robot. What moments made visibility bad?
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Unread 11-01-2018, 12:39 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

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Originally Posted by ns3517 View Post
2015? I operated and had no issues with seeing our robot. What moments made visibility bad?
If your robot only played in the space between the driver station and front of the platforms, it probably wasn't a problem. If you played between the platforms or in the landfill, it became very hard to see the robot behind a wall of capped 6-stacks.

For example:
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Unread 11-01-2018, 12:40 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

Quote:
Originally Posted by ns3517 View Post
2015? I operated and had no issues with seeing our robot. What moments made visibility bad?
Stacks and Stacks, and poorly placed stacks. Or just tons and tons of stacks. With the occasional giant robot in the way.

EDIT: Sniped by AriMB
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Unread 11-01-2018, 01:15 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

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Originally Posted by cscottm View Post
Stacks and Stacks, and poorly placed stacks. Or just tons and tons of stacks. With the occasional giant robot in the way.

EDIT: Sniped by AriMB
Was kinda like this:

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Unread 11-01-2018, 04:03 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

I wish they'd bring back driver station pole cams from 2016. They were awesome for seeing the field and as a bonus you'd have your match recorded & ready to watch when you got back to the pits.
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Unread 11-01-2018, 04:36 PM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

Quote:
Originally Posted by AriMB View Post
2015, 2016, 2017, and 2018 have all had significant visibility issues. I find it hard to imagine any driver or coach from those years saying that they have never had a problem with not being able to see the robot. And unless you're driving the robot virtually (i.e. not by sight), that is bound to inhibit your team's performance.

I imagine this survey is preceding either some kind of product release or a petition for FIRST to get rid of tall field-elements. I'll reserve judgement until that comes out.
2012 and 2013 were pretty good, and 2014 was excellent, as there were so few field elements between a few inches and six feet from the floor. 2016 and 2017 were terrible by design; too many opaque and glare-inducing field elements. 2015 started great but got bad really quick unless you carefully coordinated mining the landfill with placing stacks. 2018 wasn't nearly as bad as the three preceding years; the switch walls were low and mostly transparent, and the scale wasn't particularly wide at low altitudes.

Another possibility is that this is to justify spending money and/or time implementing a streaming camera. Not a major expense, but one that some teams need to plan in advance if they're going to have it.
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Unread 11-02-2018, 09:29 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

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Originally Posted by Ryan Dognaux View Post
I wish they'd bring back driver station pole cams from 2016. They were awesome for seeing the field and as a bonus you'd have your match recorded & ready to watch when you got back to the pits.
How about a compromise: the field has two "pole cams", one on each driver station side, that can be accessed via the dashboard while at the field and footage downloaded at the end of the match.

Would be not _that_ expensive, much safer, and would be available to everyone.
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Unread 11-05-2018, 11:02 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

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Originally Posted by Owen Busler View Post
Interesting set of questions... what are you hoping to see with this data and what are your plans for the results?
My teammate and I are trying to create a module that will go on the robot, "communicate" with the field, and gives feedback to display the current position of the robot on an aerial view of the field on a monitor.
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Unread 11-05-2018, 11:09 AM
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Re: Visual of the Robot on the Competition Field

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Originally Posted by Clayton Yocom View Post
How about a compromise: the field has two "pole cams", one on each driver station side, that can be accessed via the dashboard while at the field and footage downloaded at the end of the match.

Would be not _that_ expensive, much safer, and would be available to everyone.
Sounds great to me. C'mon FIRST, make it happen!

Here's an example of what we'd have the second we got back to the pit in 2016: https://youtu.be/Z0aSxoOGtEE it was really helpful for evaluating what happened post-match with the drive team. We used a GoPro on an extendable painter's pole and also fed that to a separate monitor during the match.
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Last edited by Ryan Dognaux : 11-05-2018 at 11:26 AM.
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