OCCRA
Go to Post It isn't what you're given that makes it awesome. It's what you do with it. - JosephC [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Technical > Robotics Education and Curriculum
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 10:10 AM
GCarnes's Avatar
GCarnes GCarnes is offline
Registered User
FRC #5150 (Hybrid Hornets)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Michigan
Posts: 35
GCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really nice
Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

If a week long summer camp was created to target middle schoolers to prepare them to join a high school FIRST team, what major skills (two or three) do you think are the most important?

Examples: how to solder, how to use tools/shop safety, how gears work, etc.
__________________



Last edited by GCarnes : 01-12-2018 at 11:52 AM. Reason: Clarity
Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 10:14 AM
Boltman Boltman is offline
Strategy/Rules/Scouting/Volunteer
AKA: Tom Byrne
FRC #5137 (Iron Kodiaks)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,362
Boltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant futureBoltman has a brilliant future
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

1. Desire
2. Attendance
3. Ideas

In no particular order
__________________


Iron Kodiaks Team #5137 San Marcos, CA
2018 Orange County Elimination Alliance (5477.5209) QF
2017 Ventura Captain 3 (8, 3882) QF
2016 Central Valley Captain 2 (973, 2135) SF
2015 Ventura Elimination Alliances (696, 1836) SF
2014 San Diego Rookie All-Star Galileo Division
San Diego (Home regional/practice days) : Not chosen '18 Elimination Alliances:'17 (399, 968) SF ,'16 (1159, 812) SF , '15 (3021, 1772) QF

Volunteer @ Orange County 2016, 2017, 2018 Ventura 2018
Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 10:15 AM
EricLeifermann's Avatar
EricLeifermann EricLeifermann is offline
Pick and Place FTW
FRC #2826 (Wave Robotics)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,304
EricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond reputeEricLeifermann has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCarnes View Post
If a week long summer camp was created to target middle schoolers to prepare them to join a high school FIRST team, what major skills (two or three) do you think are the most important?
Being able to effectively communicate, not being afraid to ask questions, and a willingness to learn.

But if your looking for skills that will give them a head start....

Be able to write a simple program in the language your team uses, know how to draw a basic part in the CAD software you use, and how to use hand tools.
__________________
2002-2005 Appleton East High School: Team 93
2005-2011 Michigan Technological University: Team 857
2012-Present Wave Robotics Team 2826



Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 10:32 AM
Fields's Avatar
Fields Fields is offline
Classic
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Rookie Year: 2015
Location: South Saint Paul
Posts: 203
Fields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to behold
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Tough question with it open-ended like that.

Some like to try everything, some only like the build, some want nothing to do with the build.


Off the top of my head if I were to do a week-long camp, I think I would focus on a different aspect every day. Don't focus on just the robot (FRC is so much more than that) and don't bother trying to really teach anything. Once they find something they like, they pick it up faster than us old farts.

Some ideas on that note.
Strategy - review a past game kickoff and come up with ideas for a build and play strategy, then look at videos to see how other teams played it out and what strategies they used.

Building - build a kitbot together and let them drive
This includes mechanical, electrical and programming

Media - Make a video, have them create an extra webpage on your site, do logo design

Team building and gracious professionalism - Do some community service

There are many more ideas, but you only have a week. Try to go broad and clear rather than deep and confusing.
__________________
Wait... you built what now?

♪ 99 little bugs in the code
99 little bugs ♫
Take one down, patch it around
108 little bugs in the code ♫ ♪ ♫
Reply With Quote
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 11:51 AM
GCarnes's Avatar
GCarnes GCarnes is offline
Registered User
FRC #5150 (Hybrid Hornets)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Michigan
Posts: 35
GCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really nice
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltman View Post
1. Desire
2. Attendance
3. Ideas

In no particular order
All very important, but I was more looking for skills that could be taught. Things like shop/tool training, how gears work, how to solder, etc.

The three you listed are very important though.
__________________


Reply With Quote
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 12:08 PM
SPang SPang is online now
Stephen Pang
FRC #3146 (Granby GRUNTS)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: CT
Posts: 172
SPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond reputeSPang has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Personally I view the most important skills for FRC is effective communication and teamwork. They're great skills beyond just the scope of FIRST.

But if you're really looking for just plain hard skills, for people coming into FRC teach them:
1. Building with safety in mind (this can be through building something like a kitbot and walking them through the steps)
2. Basic design (this can be through doing a classic catapult competition)
3. Game analysis (have them finish the program by analyzing an old game and come up with a basic robot strategy and idea as a team to simulate kickoff)

Skills like CAD, programming, and design based on gearing/physics/etc should be learned when they're actually on the team during the offseason, rather than during a week long summer camp.

Like others have said, make the material broad, don't try to dig deep into the technicalities since this will most likely be the first foray into robotics for most kids. Make it inspiring and encouraging.
__________________
ÜberBots (FRC 1124) | 2014 - 2017
Granby GRUNTS (FRC 3146) | 2018 - ????
LGBTQ+ of FIRST Ambassador | 2017 - ????
NE FIRST Volunteer | 2016 - ????
Reply With Quote
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 12:10 PM
Fields's Avatar
Fields Fields is offline
Classic
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Rookie Year: 2015
Location: South Saint Paul
Posts: 203
Fields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to beholdFields is a splendid one to behold
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCarnes View Post
All very important, but I was more looking for skills that could be taught. Things like shop/tool training, how gears work, how to solder, etc.

The three you listed are very important though.
Those can all be taught easily during the school year leading up to build season. For a summer camp, wouldn't it be better to get the kids interested in the program first?

It looks like you're trying to teach technical skills for a short time in the summer, then relying on them to remember it again after school starts.
__________________
Wait... you built what now?

♪ 99 little bugs in the code
99 little bugs ♫
Take one down, patch it around
108 little bugs in the code ♫ ♪ ♫
Reply With Quote
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 12:12 PM
NathanStro's Avatar
NathanStro NathanStro is offline
Drive/Programming/Webmaster
AKA: Nathan Strodtbeck
FRC #5980 (East Grand Rapids Robotics)
Team Role: Driver
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Rookie Year: 2016
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 163
NathanStro is just really niceNathanStro is just really niceNathanStro is just really niceNathanStro is just really niceNathanStro is just really nice
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

The ability to communicate ideas effectively
__________________


DRIVE TEAM Operator 2016: Worlds St. Louis | Driver 2017: Worlds St. Louis | Driver 2018: Worlds Detroit
"Its not about the robot"
"Build A Robot, Build a Team, Build a Future"
"Robots is hard"
Reply With Quote
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 12:15 PM
D_Price's Avatar
D_Price D_Price is offline
Engineer/Mentor
AKA: Derek
FRC #1708 (Amp'd Robotics (formally Natural Selection))
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: McKeesport, Pa
Posts: 678
D_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant futureD_Price has a brilliant future
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCarnes View Post
If a week long summer camp was created to target middle schoolers to prepare them to join a high school FIRST team, what major skills (two or three) do you think are the most important?

Examples: how to solder, how to use tools/shop safety, how gears work, etc.
Day 1 - Intro into FIRST-explaining what FIRST is and how it pertains to the real-world, your team, etc.

Day 2- Programming - Use whatever language your team uses (Java, C++, etc) and have them write a basic program in the language.

Day 3- CAD Design/Brainstorming - How to effectively "think" and design of a robot. Show them a prior game and have them come up with how they would build a robot.

Day 4- Strategy and teamwork - Split them into groups and show a prior game and ask what they think should be focused on and what isn't as important..etc

Day 5- Safety - At some point stress to them how to safely work in the pits, lab, whatever you use for a work area on the robot.
__________________
Team member 2004-2008
Team mentor 2008-20XX
http://www.team1708.com/
"Education is a powerful tool. Always use it to better someone else's life"
Reply With Quote
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 01:53 PM
GCarnes's Avatar
GCarnes GCarnes is offline
Registered User
FRC #5150 (Hybrid Hornets)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Michigan
Posts: 35
GCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really niceGCarnes is just really nice
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanStro View Post
The ability to communicate ideas effectively
Very important, any suggestions on how to teach ideas like this?
__________________


Reply With Quote
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 02:18 PM
Jon Stratis's Avatar
Jon Stratis Jon Stratis is offline
Mentor, LRI, MN RPC
FRC #2177 (The Robettes)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 5,007
Jon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond reputeJon Stratis has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

We run just such a camp... the idea isn't so much to teach them skills (although everyone walks away with some intro level programming, soldering, and shop tool use) as it is to expose them to all parts of the team. It's not a training camp, it's a recruitment camp. Provide enough different things so the students get excited about something or other and want to come back to join that part of the team and learn more.
__________________
LRI: North Star 2012-2016; Lake Superior 2013-2014; MN State Tournament 2013-2014, 2016-2018; Iowa 2017; Northern Lights 2018; Great Northern 2018
Division LRI: Galileo 2016; Tesla 2017; Archimedes 2018
2015: North Star Regional Volunteer of the Year
2016: Lake Superior WFFA
Reply With Quote
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 02:45 PM
Nora Krakishyan Nora Krakishyan is offline
Registered User
FRC #0696
Team Role: Programmer
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Rookie Year: 2016
Location: California
Posts: 5
Nora Krakishyan is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

I would say basic build skills and design skills would be the most effective.
The most effective way to go about it, in my opinion would be giving them a task and they have to build a prototype for it, in this process they can learn both tools and design concept.
Reply With Quote
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 03:05 PM
usbcd36's Avatar
usbcd36 usbcd36 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Chris Dickey
FRC #2399 (The Fighting Unicorns)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Solon, OH
Posts: 165
usbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to beholdusbcd36 is a splendid one to behold
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

I am strongly in favor of a concrete approach on the technical side, even if your goal is to teach skills like communication.

In the case of communication, I find that students quickly tire of receiving the wrong item or referring to something as "the thingy", and this motivates them to learn the vocabulary.

More generally, within the context of "this mechanism must get built" or "this robot must get driving code", you can teach students how to get a message out. A student may not viscerally understand why missing dimensions are bad until they receive a drawing with a missing dimension and experience the internal frustration.

The activity itself probably isn't important, but it provides the context.
Reply With Quote
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-12-2018, 06:20 PM
xnever's Avatar
xnever xnever is offline
Registered User
AKA: Iman von Briesen
FRC #3506 (YETI Robotics)
Team Role: Leadership
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Charlotte
Posts: 2
xnever is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

I would teach them to fail fast and be able to listen to others' ideas. Being stubborn about an idea can be the downfall of the robot's mechanism.
It is also very helpful for them to have basic knowledge of the most used tools, like a hand drill and band saws.
Reply With Quote
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-13-2018, 09:54 AM
philso philso is online now
Mentor
no team
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Houston, Tx
Posts: 1,642
philso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond reputephilso has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Most Important Skill(s) Coming Into A Team?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xnever View Post
I would teach them to fail fast and be able to listen to others' ideas. Being stubborn about an idea can be the downfall of the robot's mechanism.
It is also very helpful for them to have basic knowledge of the most used tools, like a hand drill and band saws.
Have them build a simple mechanism to solve a simple problem then have them build a second, third and maybe a fourth version to solve the same problem. They should see that the last iteration is an improvement over the first one.

It would also be good to give some basic, practical physics lessons on topics such as levers, torque, gear ratios etc.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:14 PM.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi