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  #61   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-10-2018, 03:12 PM
Peter Johnson Peter Johnson is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by ErikSLee View Post
We would love to get on the list of beta testers!
Typically a beta application announcement from FIRST goes out in the summer. FIRST reviews the applications and selects the teams for beta testing, which occurs in the fall.
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Unread 05-18-2018, 08:59 AM
David Lame David Lame is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

Is there any word on how "official" this all is. I'm going to start teaching students as soon as possible. I'll be meeting with them this week, and I am wondering if I ought to tell them that we will be using VS Code next year, and if I should be checking out how to use VS Code myself along with Git so that I can teach students in the fall. If we are talking about beta testing in the fall, is this looking at a 2019 rollout, or 2020?

I'm all for flexibility, except that I'm dealing with 14 year olds with very little experience programming. "Flexibility" just means "more things that can go wrong." I want to make sure they are well versed in this stuff before kickoff, because it might take a few weeks before they get the hang of it, so I want to make sure those few weeks are not during build season.
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Unread 05-18-2018, 09:00 AM
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

One of the things I've *liked* about Eclipse over my career is the availability of good plugins for integrating other tools. SpotBugs and Eclipse-PMD are pretty helpful when dealing with student code...

I haven't been able to find equivalents for VSC. I know I can drop back to the command line to get the same functionality, but am I just not looking hard enough?
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Unread 05-18-2018, 09:23 AM
Thad House Thad House is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by David Lame View Post
snip
Yes, vs code and Gradle is what the official build system for 2019 is going to be. There will be no eclipse release for 2019.

As for the flexibility, because it's a more standard setup, less things go wrong. And if something does go wrong, unlike eclipse it's usually easier to fix because of the flexibility.
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Unread 05-18-2018, 09:29 AM
Thad House Thad House is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by fovea1959 View Post
One of the things I've *liked* about Eclipse over my career is the availability of good plugins for integrating other tools. SpotBugs and Eclipse-PMD are pretty helpful when dealing with student code...

I haven't been able to find equivalents for VSC. I know I can drop back to the command line to get the same functionality, but am I just not looking hard enough?
If you set up those plugins in Gradle, vscode won't give errors in it's main editor window, but during builds and deploy we do open a window where you can see the console commands being run. With these, you'll at least be able to see the errors in that console. I can look into making it so these errors could be parsable and display the errors in the main editor window. But other then that, that's probably one thing that isn't as integrated as eclipse.
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Unread 05-19-2018, 11:33 AM
David Lame David Lame is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by Thad House View Post
Yes, vs code and Gradle is what the official build system for 2019 is going to be. There will be no eclipse release for 2019.

As for the flexibility, because it's a more standard setup, less things go wrong. And if something does go wrong, unlike eclipse it's usually easier to fix because of the flexibility.
Thanks. Looks like it's off to the download page.
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Unread 06-16-2018, 09:58 PM
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Thumbs up Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

This is awesome news! Thanks for all the work that went into this.

What we really need now is a VSCode extension to officially support C# using RobotDotNet! Any plans Thad?
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Unread 06-17-2018, 11:22 AM
Thad House Thad House is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by Vyrotek View Post
This is awesome news! Thanks for all the work that went into this.

What we really need now is a VSCode extension to officially support C# using RobotDotNet! Any plans Thad?
If I were to ever restart work on RobotDotNet I definitely would, however I currently have no plans to do that. With other commitments I just no longer have the free time to support the actual library development. If somebody wants to pick of the development of the libraries, I have mostly completed getting deployment working with the .net core CLI, so it would actually be really easy to get working in VS Code, but it would require the libraries being actively worked on for me to pick that back up.

I might try to work on at least the P/Invoke layer for the HAL, which is the biggest thing that needs changing for now, and I have an NT Core 4.0 rewrite basically done, but the main libraries still need a lot of work.
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Unread 07-01-2018, 04:20 AM
tcjinaz tcjinaz is offline
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by David Lame View Post
I'm dealing with fourteen year old programmers who have barely gotten past "Hello, World." Being "flexible" is not a good thing in that situation. It often means that there are lots of options, but if you get them wrong, nothing works.

As long as there is a one click solution that I can tell freshmen, "When your code is ready, click this to deploy it to the RoboRio," things will be ok.

A bonus would be non-cryptic error messages for when their network was disconnected, or when they failed to set up some of the required settings.

In general, I'm a big fan of Visual Studio as a developer environment precisely because I have found it easier to get up and running right out of the box than I found with Eclipse. I want an environment that runs the first time if you follow the directions, and I want those diretions to be as short as possible and as easy to understand as possible. I have enough trouble teaching kids what a null pointer exception is and why they got one.

A perfect tool would be one that a freshman can use without difficulty, and the professional programmers who serve as mentors can do the things they've learned to do in their years of programming experience. However, if there has to be a compromise between the two attributes, the former should be prioritized over the latter.
Forgive me, but I think you just described the FRC/LabView experience.

With just one qualifier: the mentors with professional programming experince have exposure to data flow design techniques.
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Unread 07-01-2018, 12:25 PM
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

A little nervous since I've never used VS Code (Will be my second year programming and this year we used Eclipse) but due to the overwhelmingly positive responses from this news, I'm definitely excited to start experimenting with this. I've definitely had my fair share of issues with eclipse, as well as WPILib libraries so the change to VS Code will likely be more than worth it if it fixes the issues I've had in the past. Awesome work!
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Unread 07-01-2018, 04:22 PM
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

So just to clarify, teams will be unable to you use Eclipse for the 2019 season or will it still be an option?
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Unread 07-01-2018, 04:31 PM
nickbrickmaster nickbrickmaster is online now
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Re: WPILib is adapting GradleRIO - Jaci has become too powerful and we must stop her

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Originally Posted by risho900 View Post
So just to clarify, teams will be unable to you use Eclipse for the 2019 season or will it still be an option?
There will be no 2019 Eclipse plugins. However, as Gradle is IDE-agnostic, it is possible to use GradleRIO in Eclipse. You will lack some of the integration features.
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Last edited by nickbrickmaster : 07-01-2018 at 04:34 PM. Reason: clarify
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