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Unread 01-05-2007, 01:59 PM
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Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Im thinking about hooking up my drive team (the mentors for all three allince teams, plus anouther member of our team in the stands.) with bluettoth headsets so that it wil be easier to communicate bewteen each other douring a match.

is that legal.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:02 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Yea I pretty sure that it is, I can't quote a specific rule but I am sure someone in the next 3-4 posts will find it for you.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:11 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreedomForce View Post
Im thinking about hooking up my drive team (the mentors for all three allince teams, plus anouther member of our team in the stands.) with bluettoth headsets so that it wil be easier to communicate bewteen each other douring a match.

is that legal.
Ask again later. The rules for 2007 are not out yet and can change year to year. However, in years past this has not been allowed.

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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:15 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Seeing that tomarrow we will have a brand new set of rules, I am going to wait to post any rules (even rules from last year).
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:17 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

In the past, even hand signaling between a non-drive-team member and a drive-team member has been illegal.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:21 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

i remember that my old team used to scream RAMP with 20 seconds left from the stands at UCF. it sometimes worked. idk.

but what about communicating within your alliance. like team A mentor Team B mentor and team C mentor all on a three way call in their respective drive stations on the red alince.

so what, this wasn't legal in previous years???
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:24 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Nope. The only way/form of communications in years past have been behind the driver station between the drive-teams. No radios, cameras, or cell phones are to be used during a match; there are some "grey areas" in this rule that some teams step on the edge between grey and black. I know of a few teams who have people positioned around the field to give help to the drivers, however this is illegal and they rarely ever get asked to sit down. Rules are rules.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 02:26 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreedomForce View Post
i remember that my old team used to scream RAMP with 20 seconds left from the stands at UCF. it sometimes worked. idk.

but what about communicating within your alliance. like team A mentor Team B mentor and team C mentor all on a three way call in their respective drive stations on the red alince.

so what, this wasn't legal in previous years???
There was a team that tried using an intra-alliance comm system with headsets. It sounds like a good idea, but I'm not sure how well it worked.
Personally, I would never rely on a device another team made to communicate with them, nor would I expect other teams to use something I made.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:03 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Hey guys, here is my question, i have an amateur radio license and so does the mentor of our team, was it allowed to use a hand held amateur radio to communicate between the pits and competition floor between matches in the past years??
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:05 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

I think that because it is a wireless communication it isnt. But then again I heard that they used wireless video cameras. So wait till the rules come out.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:26 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

3.14.3 Pit and competition Safety
Two-way radios: Not allowed in the Pit or near the playing field since they may interfere with robot operation and cause accidents
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:34 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IndySam View Post
3.14.3 Pit and competition Safety
Two-way radios: Not allowed in the Pit or near the playing field since they may interfere with robot operation and cause accidents
Even if the radios are of the amateur radio service and work at a much higher frequency than the robot radios?
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:47 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eshteyn View Post
Even if the radios are of the amateur radio service and work at a much higher frequency than the robot radios?
It's better to be safe than sorry.
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Unread 01-05-2007, 03:50 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by InfernoX14 View Post
It's better to be safe than sorry.
Point taken, thank you
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Unread 01-05-2007, 04:04 PM
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Re: Bluetooth Headsets+Drive Teams=?legality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eshteyn View Post
Even if the radios are of the amateur radio service and work at a much higher frequency than the robot radios?
Standard disclaimer applies that all discussion here is based on the rules as they existed in 2006 and prior, which may change this year (though I'd say it's unlikely)...

The rule was as stated above. There were no exceptions mentioned. If it was a two-way radio then it was not allowed, plain and simple.

Now, to provide a little reasoning to that, even if you're using a radio that operates at a different frequency it can still cause interference. All radio transmitters create "harmonics" which are signals at frequencies other than the intended transmit frequency. For example, if you were using a UHF radio around 450MHz, the first harmonic would be right around the frequency in use by our FIRST robots (900MHz). Depending on the power output and quality of the radio, this could easily be enough to cause interference with the radios in use on the robots. The radios we're using are only outputting signals in the milliwatt range, so even a 5W handheld could easily dominate them.

Further, from an administrative point of view, I'm sure FIRST does not want to burden volunteers with having to inspect a two-way radio to ensure that it will not interfere. It's easier to just make a blanket rule disallowing any of them and then the volunteers don't have to understand which frequencies are OK and which aren't, they can simply ask anyone using a radio to stop.
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