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  #46   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 10-04-2018, 04:58 PM
risho900 risho900 is offline
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Nevermind, I did not enable the PCM. I think the pressure switch is broken though as the pressure gauge stops at ~40 while the pressure gauge that connects to solenoid goes up as it is supposed to.

EDIT: Or could it be just the pressure switch gauge that is broken?

Last edited by risho900 : 10-04-2018 at 05:02 PM.
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Unread 10-04-2018, 05:36 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

That sounds more like the regulator is not plumbed correctly or you're looking at the wrong gauge.
On the back of the regulator you should see an arrow.
The port opposite the TAIL of the arrow is where the high pressure line from the compressor and storage tanks should connect. All other regulator ports are the low pressure side.


The pressure switch won't disable the compressor until the high pressure side reaches ~115psi.
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Unread 10-08-2018, 04:09 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Always suspect that gauges are not telling the truth if other indicators are saying everything is working right.
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Unread 10-09-2018, 03:37 PM
risho900 risho900 is offline
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark McLeod View Post
That sounds more like the regulator is not plumbed correctly or you're looking at the wrong gauge.
On the back of the regulator you should see an arrow.
The port opposite the TAIL of the arrow is where the high pressure line from the compressor and storage tanks should connect. All other regulator ports are the low pressure side.


The pressure switch won't disable the compressor until the high pressure side reaches ~115psi.
I looked at it but I couldn't find any arrows. We have the one from the KOP. Also, I ran the compressor until the solenoid gauge read ~120 and the compressor didn't turn off. Could this mean broken pressure switch?
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Unread 10-10-2018, 07:58 PM
risho900 risho900 is offline
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Also, someone mind linking me to a chart or something that I can use to determine how many air tanks I would need for a pneumatic set up. I know I read it somewhere but I forget.
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Unread 10-10-2018, 08:16 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by risho900 View Post
Also, someone mind linking me to a chart or something that I can use to determine how many air tanks I would need for a pneumatic set up. I know I read it somewhere but I forget.
Basically, it depends on how much air you need in a short period of time. The compressor is only going to be able to give you 1.05 scfm (IIRC from 2018 rules) at low pressure, and likely about 0.6 or so scfm at 120 psi. If you're doing actions which only require small amounts of air (e.g. shifting a transmission), you are only using the tank to provide a bit of leveling, and one of the recent plastic tanks would be more than enough. If you are planning to power a climb with pneumatics (which I heartily do not recommend after my 2013 experience), you want to have enough air in the tanks to power the whole climb, which might mean a half dozen or more tanks (IIRC, 3946 had seven plastic tanks in 2013). 3946's post season robot this year used pneumatics to raise and lower a relatively light arm which was usually also lifting a cube (displacement was about 11 cubic inches); we typically cycled this three to eight times a match, fairly widely spread in time. We used two of the older-style aluminum tanks with just a bit more combined capacity than one of the current generation of plastic tanks, and had no pneumatics shortage issues.

1) figure out how many scfm your system needs per cycle.
2) figure out how many cycles you need in what duration
3) Calculate the air needed in terms of scfm.
4) If the answer is less than a half, one tank is likely good.
5) If most of the usage is in a 30 second period, figure out how many scfm you need and have tanks which store that much air. (Note that at 120 psi, you can get nearly 5000 sml
5) If the answer is greater than a half, profile your usage against a compressor and figure it out
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Last edited by GeeTwo : 10-10-2018 at 08:44 PM.
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Unread 10-12-2018, 02:06 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark McLeod View Post
That sounds more like the regulator is not plumbed correctly or you're looking at the wrong gauge.
On the back of the regulator you should see an arrow.
The port opposite the TAIL of the arrow is where the high pressure line from the compressor and storage tanks should connect. All other regulator ports are the low pressure side.


The pressure switch won't disable the compressor until the high pressure side reaches ~115psi.
Oh I misread, it is plumbed correctly. Yet the pressure switch fails to turn off the compressor.
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Unread 10-16-2018, 01:59 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Risho,
You can use a multimeter across the terminals of the switch to determine if it is changing state when the pressure is high. Do you use teflon tape to help seal your threaded fittings? If so, it is possible for the teflon to have ended up across the face of the threaded portion of the switch and closed it off from the system.
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Unread 10-16-2018, 02:39 PM
risho900 risho900 is offline
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz View Post
Risho,
You can use a multimeter across the terminals of the switch to determine if it is changing state when the pressure is high. Do you use teflon tape to help seal your threaded fittings? If so, it is possible for the teflon to have ended up across the face of the threaded portion of the switch and closed it off from the system.
But I'm able to release all the air from the valve connected to pressure switch so shouldn't teflon not be an issue then? I'll use the multimeter method to check the pressure switch. Just to confirm though, once the compressor turns off, will it be audible?
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Unread 10-18-2018, 12:48 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

I am suggesting that the Teflon tape is closing off the input port to the switch.
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Unread 10-18-2018, 05:20 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz View Post
I am suggesting that the Teflon tape is closing off the input port to the switch.
Ah I see, well I tried the multimeter method and when the pressure reached about 120, the pressure switch voltage jumped to ~0.75V and stayed there. However the compressor was still making noise so does this mean it worked?
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Unread 10-18-2018, 08:09 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Here's a simple test to see if your PCM is operating as expected.
If you disconnect the pressure switch from the PCM entirely--as in, take the pressure switch wires out of the PCM--then the PCM should turn the compressor off. The PCM senses if there is pressure switch wiring attached.

Does it?
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Last edited by Mark McLeod : 10-18-2018 at 08:15 PM.
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Unread 10-18-2018, 08:50 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark McLeod View Post
Here's a simple test to see if your PCM is operating as expected.
If you disconnect the pressure switch from the PCM entirely--as in, take the pressure switch wires out of the PCM--then the PCM should turn the compressor off. The PCM senses if there is pressure switch wiring attached.

Does it?
i removed the wires and the robot would not stay enabled. I tried to enable it, it would enable for a second and then disable. I assume this means the PCM is working?
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Unread 10-18-2018, 08:53 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Indeterminate.
The robot should not Disable with the wires removed from the PCM.
The PCM test needs the robot to remain Enabled after the pressure switch wires are disconnected.

There is something else going on that's causing the auto Disable.
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Unread 10-18-2018, 09:13 PM
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Re: Pneumatic System Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark McLeod View Post

There is something else going on that's causing the auto Disable.
Try restarting the FRC Driver Station program, this happens to us after we wake up the laptop from sleep and this fixes it.
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