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Unread 06-23-2002, 09:55 PM
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Re: window motors

Posted by Pat Seeney, Student on team #163, Quantum Mechanics, from International Academy.

Posted on 3/2/99 2:48 PM MST



Mr. Johnson,

what model, make, and year do the window motors come from? Is it a 96 buick century? Is there a difference between a 98 and 96 buick century window motor? We need the correct specs in order to fix the motors i.e. we need to make a bracket for them. So we need to know the exact motor FIRST supplied us with

Thanks!
Pat Team 163


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Unread 06-23-2002, 09:56 PM
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Here is the trouble

Posted by Joe Johnson, Engineer on team #47, Chief Delphi, from Pontiac Central High School and Delphi Automotive Systems.

Posted on 3/3/99 8:53 PM MST


In Reply to: Re: window motors posted by Pat Seeney on 3/2/99 2:48 PM MST:



Okay,

Here is the trouble....

The tape drive window lift units have been out of production (except on GM Electic Vehicle) since 1996 (model year, not calendar year).

The housings for all GM tape drive units come in basically 2 flavors, one that used the "sheet metal motor" -- not the one you want, and the one that uses the "phase 3" motor -- the one you want.

There are many models that used this tape drive system, but, I can only state for sure that the pre-1996 Buick "W" car (ask the dealer -- I think that the W was the Regal, but again, memory fails me). Anyway, the housings are from that vehicle are the housings you want.

When it comes to the motors, life is more difficult. When I got these things donated to the FIRST kit, Delphi was in the window regulator business, so it was relatively easy to get information and parts etc. But, Delphi has sold their window regulator business, so life is more complicated.

I was able to convince Delphi's management to continue to purchase the parts that we no longer use in production in order to give them to FIRST. While I was doing that, I decided to try to get the individual suppliers of the parts to donate them directly to FIRST without us acting as a middle man (I had plans to get my management to donate other stuff so I had to dish off as much of the load as possible ;-). Anyway, I was successful in getting ITTA to donate the window motors for the tape drive mechanism. This was great and it allowed me to get our management to pop for donating Delphi power sliding door motors.

Well, ITTA, looked at the part number for the window motor FIRST needed and realized that it was a "service part" That didn't mean anything to me, because part of the deal that a supplier to Delphi makes is to provide service parts at production prices, but to ITTA, "service part" means low volume that that means $$$$. So, ITTA supplied a SIMILAR motor but not the same motor. As a result, FIRST supplies all teams with that washer and the bushing to support the shaft of the motor. This is a fix that Brian Farmer and I worked out to deal with the fact that the motor doesn't quite fit that housing (specifically the motor shaft is too short to be supported by the housing).

By the way, hasn't anyone else thought is was odd that FIRST has you put a bearing on a shaft that does not rotate -- now you know the rest of the story.

Anyway, bottom line, I don't know what car the motor they donated came from. I used to know, in fact it was posted on last year's web board, but it has long since been purged from both my brain and our host computer.

So... I don't know what to tell you concerning this motor. I can tell you that it is almost exactly the same as the motor out of the 1996 Buick W car. The only difference is 1) the electrical connector, 2) the face with of the 12 tooth pinion, and 3) the associated length of the (non-rotating) shaft that the pinion turns on.

I know this is a long message, but I hope it points you in the right direction.

Joe J.


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