Some Questions from a rookie team.

[ming08108]

Hello I have recently started a new team in in Chapel Hill, NC at East Chapel Hill HS. We have gotten the NASA grant and have the registration fee . I have some questions regarding the completion.

I will update this list as answers have been posted or new questions arise.

Answered!
1. I have noticed FIRST Choice opens Mon, what parts do you think a rookie team like us should get.

2. I have Noticed that the GTX 560 is really cheap on FIRST Choice, do you think it would be a good idea to get these and sell them to raise money? (Is this even allowed?)

3. What kind of parts and tools do you think we should buy?

4. Does FIRST Choice require you to pay shipping?

5. We still need to acquire more money for parts. I was thinking maybe $2000 (For everything other than registration costs.), is this a good estimate? (Note we live quite close to the regional, so hotels and transportation should not be an issue)
Also any good ideas for fundraising/companies that are willing to help?


I will update this list as new questions arise.

Thanks in advance!

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by ming08108

Hello I have recently started a new team in in Chapel Hill, NC at East Chapel Hill HS. We have gotten the NASA grant and have the registration fee . I have some questions regarding the completion.

I will update this list as answers have been posted or new questions arise.

1. I have noticed FIRST Choice opens Mon, what parts do you think a rookie team like us should get.

2. I have Noticed that the GTX 560 is really cheap on FIRST Choice, do you think it would be a good idea to get these and sell them to raise money? (Is this even allowed?)

3. What kind of parts and tools do you think we should buy?

I will update this list as new question arise.

Thanks in advance!

About the only thing I could say you'd use with near-absolute certainty is something like the Talon speed controller or another battery. Your rookie kit will cover a lot of these things, and others are all going to depend on your game strategy. Tools like the circular saw, right angle drill, and multimeter (that's a nice one--we got it last year) will depend on what's already available to you.

Selling parts from the kit (and FIRST Choice is part of the kit) is frowned upon in the strongest of terms. Incorporating unused items in other team projects fares much better.

There are many threads on CD for parts and tools. AndyMark and Vex Robotics (also referred to as IFI around here for their parent company) are the two 800-pound gorillas of FRC-specific parts, but suppliers like McMaster-Carr, 80/20, Grainger, and even your local hardware store are all great suppliers to work with. We've found great success with square tubing and riveted gussets, but your team will have a particular style develop around its resources and expertise. There are tons of wrong ways to build an FRC robot, but also many valid ones.

[wasayanwer97]

Originally Posted by ming08108

4. Does FIRST Choice require you to pay shipping?

Yes, while the items are free, teams pay the shipping costs for those items.

[ttldomination]

Originally Posted by ming08108

1. I have noticed FIRST Choice opens Mon, what parts do you think a rookie team like us should get.

Raw materials/resources. Tools, metal, motors, gearboxes. Find what's available on FIRST Choice and grab the expensive items off that list.

To better gauge this, take a look at last year's KOP and what you receive.

Originally Posted by ming08108

2. I have Noticed that the GTX 560 is really cheap on FIRST Choice, do you think it would be a good idea to get these and sell them to raise money? (Is this even allowed?)

Generally, for a team that's just starting up an inventory, you can generally put FIRST Choice to good use. As far as allowed is concerned, I haven't seen a rule about this, but I suppose the morals of this are up to your team.

Originally Posted by Billfred

Selling parts from the kit (and FIRST Choice is part of the kit) is frowned upon in the strongest of terms. Incorporating unused items in other team projects fares much better.

Hmm, first I'm hearing about this. Since FIRST Choice seems to be companies dumping inventories anyways, I don't quite get this...

[mrmummert]

Hello from 1610...

First you might want to contact team 3331 which is near-by to you for advice.
One of their mentors used to be on our team. We started in 2005 and still have
some things we've never used from our rookie year. You might want to hang on
to things even if you don't use them as one year you might need them.

Hand tools...you can never have enough of. A good drill press and miter
saw with a aluminium blade will help a lot. You'll need at least one good vice
and work bench. Be prepared to buy lots of parts , but if you design and
plan your robot well that will help keep the parts list (and spare parts)
down. Try to keep spares of your most important parts. You can never have
enough Victors and other controllers. In the off season they can be used for
practice and training. Don't forget the safety stuff. Keep plenty of safety
glasses and a good first aid kit on hand.

Its also a good idea to contact your regional director and area senior mentor
for advice and help. Other teams near-by can help sometimes. Your probably
going to go to the NC regional and they have a good bunch of folks that run
that.

[MARS_James]

Originally Posted by ming08108

5. We still need to acquire more money for parts. I was thinking maybe $2000 (For everything other than registration costs.), is this a good estimate? (Note we live quite close to the regional, so hotels and transportation should not be an issue)
Also any good ideas for fundraising/companies that are will to help?

Personally, I don't think $2000 is enough for other parts but then again we don't use a lot of KOP materials. Also you need to figure out which aspects of FIRST you want to participate in because if your team wants Team Shirts (Imagery) or Buttons (Spirit) then you probably will need more money

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by ming08108

5. We still need to acquire more money for parts. I was thinking maybe $2000 (For everything other than registration costs.), is this a good estimate? (Note we live quite close to the regional, so hotels and transportation should not be an issue)

$2,000 for everything may be cutting it a little close, especially for a rookie team still building up. 2815's robot bill of materials was around $1,200 last year by FIRST's accounting rules--that excludes things like wasted material, prototyping, and parts under $1/each (they rack up!), but also includes things like extra speed controllers plucked from old robots that we didn't actually put out cash for.

Other things you'll probably wind up spending on:

• Team giveaways (buttons are the standard--ask around your school if anyone has a press)
• Team T-shirts (2815 has used rushordertees.com for a few years now, but you may have a good local source)
• Pit supplies (toolboxes, storage bins, display boards touting your work...)
• A flag (entirely optional--we haven't gotten one in four seasons--but it does add something to the on-field presence when the emcee's waving it)
• Tools, of course...
• A stand to hold that regional champion banner. (Gotta have a dream, right?)

[Greg Young]

Team 587 just a few miles west on I-40 in Hillsborough. We would be happy to provide any help we can. We usually meet Monday and Thursday 5:30 to 7:30 at Orange High. Contact us before you come to make sure we're meeting.

I would advise getting on First Choice as soon as it opens and trying to score a couple of Talons. You are going to want a four motor drive and the Talons will sell out fast. A couple of CIMs to go with the Talons would be useful, but they are only $28 from AndyMark. A couple of batteries would also be good since it's hard to compete without four batteries. Other than that it is hard to say since we don't know what the game is and some game specific items won't be listed until after kickoff.

One thing I would do is download the game docs from last year and study the robot rules. Especially the bumper rules. Many rookie teams get bitten by the bumpers every year. It's never too early to get pool noodles.

$2,000 may be enough if you keep the robot fairly simple. We spend at least that on non-kit parts each year.

I would add a robot cart to Billfred's list. You will need one.

[jvriezen]

A very important item to get is a good quality scale, one such as this one:

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/OHA...XK1?Pid=search

It is important that the read out give you .2 lbs precision or better and be tethered rather than right on the scale, so you can see the weight of your robot while its on the scale. You'll want to have a 'weight budget' for the various portions of your robot and weigh things often. A common rookie issue is an overweight robot, resulting in major cutting when you get to the regional.

[DonRotolo]

I agree that $2000 might be a little light for robot build season.

As for fundraising ideas, we run to carwashes, one in the spring and the other in the fall every year. We make really good money on these. The trick is to pre-sell the tickets instead of collecting the money when people show up.

Approach local businesses and ask for a small donaton, like $100. The hardware store, the pizza place, even the gardening store and small service businesses.

[ksafin]

The money for parts obviously depends on what parts you use.

We spent about $3,500 last year (also our rookie year) on parts. We used T-Slots (Aluminum Extrusion) which was pretty cheap for the actual extrusion (maybe $500 or so total) but the brackets and bolts were INSANELY expensive, and ran us a few grand.

extrusion may have been about $1,000 actually.. I can't remember.

So yeah, if it's extrusion, which is a typical choice for an FRC rookie team, $2,000 may or may not cut it depending on a variety of factors.

[gabrielau23]

Personally I think $2000 is a little short for cash. You guys should also go for grants from other companies, too. Ask if any students have parents that work for SAIC, or other STEM related business and if they can help in procuring some funds.
DEFINITELY follow Greg's idea and get a robot cart. You WILL need it.
I would get a bunch of ratcheting wrenches and nut drivers. Duct tape for emergencies. Clamshell computers. Game controllers. I'm sure there's stuff I left out.

[pfreivald]

We ran on about $2000 our first several years, but TBH we weren't doing anything even close to "right". With KISS and a firm eye toward what you know you can do with the resources you have, you can have a great rookie year -- but things like team T-shirts can be surprisingly, even shockingly, expensive.

Don't be afraid to ask businesses to donate materials, tools, T-shirts, pizza, anything... Many are more willing to donate products than cash.

And please, don't be shy about asking nearby teams for assistance of any and every kind. From programming to machining to strategy to spare motors, veteran teams can be an absolutely amazing help to those just starting out, and they'll be overjoyed to help.

[James1902]

Welcome to FIRST! The rookie year is always an adventure, don't be afraid to ask for help from any teams near by.

It is very possible to run a succesful build and competition season with 2,000 dollars, however I think it would be beneficial to raise additinal funds for team shirts, buttons, giveaways, and printing fees for info packets to give out to judges; other teams; and local buisnesses etc.

check out this 'Fundraising 101' post for a really good list of fundraising ideas.

[Undertones]

Congratulations! Welcome to the hardest fun you'll ever have.

It looks like other CD members have answered your questions. But I have one pointer for you! Try and have a backup plan for paying for Championships. You never know! And lack of funds would be a horrible reason not to go.

Good luck this season!