The Not So-Secret Secret End-Game

[raptaconehs]

I would like to point out there is a rule stating that a robot cannot extend past 60 inches unless they are in the goalie zone. So I highly doubt that would be the case.

[UnTrustedTruss]

Originally Posted by raptaconehs

I would like to point out there is a rule stating that a robot cannot extend past 60 inches unless they are in the goalie zone. So I highly doubt that would be the case.

This is just to prevent a traveling goalie. If something so drastic as an added endgame was to happen, I am sure extending this rule to the endgame would be so stretch.

Originally Posted by Grim Tuesday

Back at an FRC Live! I went to, Bill said the GDC keeps a game in backup in case they run into a major problem with the game they were planning to play (ie supply problems). I feel like this is a backup game from circa 2010/2011. They definitely had something more in mind with the truss but cut it for some reason; I assume it was the part that was supposed to be aerial -- maybe a skyhook reverse ascent (descent) from the truss to the ground to start the match.

I doubt they will change the game midway, but that would sure be a game changer (pun intended).

Our team holds a similar opinion, this game feels like a remittent of an earlier first. In a couple of ways, it even feels like an improvement of last years game, as I listed above. I wonder if the light up bins are part of the game we could have seen this year, they are odd to include, and expensive. For simply providing us with permission to grab the ball, they seem really complicated.

[cgmv123]

Originally Posted by raptaconehs

I would like to point out there is a rule stating that a robot cannot extend past 60 inches unless they are in the goalie zone. So I highly doubt that would be the case.

The point is that since adding a "secret" endgame would require changing the rules anyway, the GDC could change the 60 inch rule as well.

This screams crazy conspiracy theory to me. (Like many other Chief Delphi theories.)

[Steven Donow]

I'm currently on the road, but is there anything in the manual similar to the past two years that says FIRST can adjust points by X amount prior to Championship? This was in the manual for the last two years for endgames. I don't recall seeing it on my initial readthroughs.

[Christopher149]

Originally Posted by DevenStonow

I'm currently on the road, but is there anything in the manual similar to the past two years that says FIRST can adjust points by X amount prior to Championship? This was in the manual for the last two years for endgames. I don't recall seeing it on my initial readthroughs.

Yes:

As competition at the FIRST Championship is typically different from that during the competition season, FIRST may alter each scoring value at the FIRST Championship by up to ten (10) points.

[Negative 9]

The game does feel incomplete, but I'm not sure FIRST would go so far as to add a whole new endgame. Also, I don't know if anyone else has pointed this out yet, but the team version drawings definitely aren't as strong as the actual game element. It can't be hanging because the team drawings use wooden planks for the bottom of the truss not aluminum tubing. Unless of course they decide to change the rules AND the team version drawings.

On a different note, it wouldn't be overly difficult for a 60" robot to pop a wheelie so that part of the robot is above the lower 62" part of the truss.

[wasayanwer97]

Just gonna leave this here...



/Sarcasm

[Racer26]

Originally Posted by Negative 9

The game does feel incomplete, but I'm not sure FIRST would go so far as to add a whole new endgame. Also, I don't know if anyone else has pointed this out yet, but the team version drawings definitely aren't as strong as the actual game element. It can't be hanging because the team drawings use wooden planks for the bottom of the truss not aluminum tubing. Unless of course they decide to change the rules AND the team version drawings.

On a different note, it wouldn't be overly difficult for a 60" robot to pop a wheelie so that part of the robot is above the lower 62" part of the truss.

The team drawings have in the past left out perfectly viable strategies available with the real field, or been such poor facsimiles that successful teams needed to build something closer to the real field.

See:

2010 Breakaway, Team drawings used 2x4 wood for the vertical supports of the tower. If you wanted to hang from that vertical member (a la 1114 and many others), you had to build something closer to the real field.

2012 Rebound Rumble, Team drawings of the bridge resulted in a bridge that was considerably lighter, and behaved totally differently to the real bridges.

2013 Ultimate Ascent, Team drawings of the pyramid were not really realistic, especially in the corner areas. Corner climbers would have had to build a mockup closer to the real pyramid.

[AlecMataloni]

No.

[DampRobot]

Originally Posted by AlecMataloni

No.

This. FIRST would never introduce a surprise endgame. It's just not going to happen.

[alextound]

I love that this thread is here. . . and seems obvious, but there is no grappling rule, which is why I came to the site today. How are we supposed to pass the ball with nothing going beyond the outside of perimiter

[MetalJacket]

Originally Posted by alextound

I love that this thread is here. . . and seems obvious, but there is no grappling rule, which is why I came to the site today. How are we supposed to pass the ball with nothing going beyond the outside of perimiter

Two things - there is a grappling rule ...

G10
The following actions are prohibited with regards to interaction with FIELD elements (excluding BALLS):

grabbing,
grasping
grappling
attaching to,
damaging,
becoming entangled

and you can go outside of your frame perimeter (20" in any direction) ...

G24
A ROBOT’S horizontal dimensions may never exceed 20 in. beyond its FRAME PERIMETER

EDIT - If you were talking about going outside of the perimeter of the field, that is allowable too if you are passing to a human player

[Robby Unruh]

Originally Posted by MetalJacket

Two things - there is a grappling rule ...

and you can go outside of your frame perimeter (20" in any direction) ...


EDIT - If you were talking about going outside of the perimeter of the field, that is allowable too if you are passing to a human player

I saw someone mention this in another thread and have been frantically searching the manual since and can't find anything on it. Where's this rule at?

[DavisC]

Originally Posted by Robby Unruh

I saw someone mention this in another thread and have been frantically searching the manual since and can't find anything on it. Where's this rule at?

He quoted Rule G24.

[Robby Unruh]

Originally Posted by DavisC

He quoted Rule G24.

I meant specifically the rule about the human player. G11 mentions it in passing.

BALLS may not be intentionally or repeatedly ejected from gameplay.

Violation: FOUL per instance.


Passing a BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER is within gameplay and not considered a violation of G11.

but this is literally all I can find on the subject in the entire manual.