Not doing autonmous

[alextound]

Could not doing autonomous to get a triple assist and get in the high goal . . . rather than an autonmous lower goal. . . please calculate . Also, would it be legal cause how does the scoreboard (lights) recognize 2 even 3 different assist build-ups???

[orangemoore]

You cannot get a assist from an autonomous ball because a cycle starts only after a ball from the pedestal is put into play

A CYCLE is the series of events that recur regularly, and each CYCLE begins with an ALLIANCE member retrieving their BALL from their lit PEDESTAL and ends when the BALL is SCORED in a GOAL. Major events in a CYCLE are depicted in Figure 3-1.

ASSISTS are earned when a unique ALLIANCE ROBOT POSSESSES the ALLIANCE’S BALL in a unique ZONE (i.e. red, white, or blue ZONE) during a CYCLE. A ROBOT is considered in a ZONE if it is in contact with the carpet in a ZONE or the tape marking the ZONE, but not in contact with carpet or tape for another ZONE. Because there are up to three (3) ALLIANCE ROBOTS and three (3) ZONES, the maximum number of ASSISTS in a single CYCLE is three (3). Examples of the number of ASSISTS credited to an ALLIANCE are shown in Figure 3-4 (X = POSSESSION, yellow highlight = credited ASSIST, ROBOT IDs are across the top, ZONES are depicted by color).

[alextound]

much thanks!!! next thought. . . use our balls as a defensive mechanicms to push their balls

[ethen155]

Originally Posted by alextound

much thanks!!! next thought. . . use our balls as a defensive mechanicms to push their balls

The rules about touching the other teams balls are very dangerous.

G12
An ALLIANCE may not POSSESS their opponent’s BALLS. The following criteria define POSSESSION :

“carrying” (moving while supporting BALLS in or on the ROBOT),
“herding” (repeated pushing or bumping),
“launching” (impelling BALLS to a desired location or direction), and
“trapping” (overt isolation or holding one or more BALLS against a FIELD element or ROBOT in an attempt to shield them).

Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL per instance.


I would consider that herding and it may result in you causing great harm to your alliance's scores.

[JohnFogarty]

Originally Posted by alextound

much thanks!!! next thought. . . use our balls as a defensive mechanicms to push their balls

By this do you mean firing your ball at the other alliance in auto to somehow disrupt their shots? Huh...didn't think of that.

[protoserge]

I suggest the following website: http://frc-manual.usfirst.org/ . It will be your friend. Look here often for team updates in the following days and weeks.

The FRC Q&A site is the single source for official answers from the Game Design Committee (GDC).

[mwtidd]

I will throw this out there. There is a scenario where skipping autonomous to go for the 3 assist may be advantageous and legal.

http://www.patriots.com/media-center...b-d3dbf0d16209

[mbshark]

Originally Posted by stinglikeabee

I suggest the following website: http://frc-manual.usfirst.org/ . It will be your friend. Look here often for team updates in the following days and weeks.

The FRC Q&A site is the single source for official answers from the Game Design Committee (GDC).

Most people posting in CD have already looked in the rules and could not find it themselves - that is why they post it here.

Also in reply to the original question on using the ball defensively, I think you might be breaking this rule:

3.2.6.2 G28
Deliberate or damaging contact with an opponent ROBOT on or inside its FRAME PERIMETER is not allowed.
Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL
For example, use of wedge-like MECHANISM to flip ROBOTS would be considered a violation of G27.

High speed accidental collisions may occur during the MATCH and are expected. ROBOTS extend elements outside of the FRAME PERIMETER at their own risk; no penalties will be assigned for contact between two such extended elements.
A ROBOT with an element outside its FRAME PERIMETER may be penalized under this rule if it appears they are using that element to purposefully contact another ROBOT inside its FRAME PERIMETER. Regardless of intent, a ROBOT with an element outside its FRAME PERIMETER that causes damage to another ROBOT inside of its FRAME PERIMETER will be penalized.

[jee7s]

Originally Posted by mbshark

Also in reply to the original question on using the ball defensively, I think you might be breaking this rule:

Nah...using the BALL wouldn't be a G28 violation as the BALL isn't an element of the ROBOT.

Using the ball herd your opponents ball seems to fall under herding. Of course, you should try to herd a ball with a ball before deciding on this strategy. Keep in mind that contact that isn't herding (like a robot form of a slide tackle) appears to be perfectly legal as the rules appear today.

[AndyBare]

I have also pondered throwing the ball at other robots during autonomous. It could deal some potential damage to their scores, and appears perfectly legal as far as I've seen.

[jee7s]

Originally Posted by AndyBare

I have also pondered throwing the ball at other robots during autonomous. It could deal some potential damage to their scores, and appears perfectly legal as far as I've seen.

There you are potentially running afoul of G27:

G27
Strategies aimed at the destruction or inhibition of ROBOTS via attachment, damage, tipping, or entanglement of ROBOTS are not allowed.

Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL and YELLOW CARD

[AndyBare]

Originally Posted by jee7s

G27
Strategies aimed at the destruction or inhibition of ROBOTS via attachment, damage, tipping, or entanglement of ROBOTS are not allowed.

Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL and YELLOW CARD:

G27 is a Robot-Robot interaction rule. A ball is not a robot.

[AndyBare]

We are not going to do that. While it is a valid strategy, I think it would be a stupid decision to waste the autonomous points to potentially stop someone else from scoring, especially when we can just make sure that our points cancel theirs (getting as many in autonomous as possible).
And Jee7, I was not saying tipping bots by launching balls at them, I meant shooting the balls to change their positioning on the field. I also did not mean to damage them, but to damage or hurt their scores. It was poorly worded. My fault.

[jee7s]

Originally Posted by AndyBare

G27 is a Robot-Robot interaction rule. A ball is not a robot.

You are certainly entering a gray area. While that rule is listed under robot-robot interactions, where does that say that the strategy involves robot-robot contact?

To simplify the statement:
A strategy aimed at inhibition of a robot via damage of a robot is not allowed.

The rule talks about the "Strategy" not "Contact". If you go out onto the field match after match and plunk the robot behind you with the ball, I think it's safe to say the referees would take issue with that.

But hey, if you want to roll those dice, that's up to you.

[themccannman]

Originally Posted by mbshark

Most people posting in CD have already looked in the rules and could not find it themselves

haha, good one.

The vast majority of the threads that I've seen on CD since kickoff (including this one) are answered directly in the manual. Both of the OP's first two questions could be answered by reading the manual more carefully. It appears that the OP's first language is not english though so I can imagine that understanding the technicalities of a rulebook not written in their native language is probably pretty difficult.