Should there be a new division in FIRST?

[Briansmithtown]

I was thinking, what if there was a college level robotics compeition ran by first?

It could be called like FCL (First College Level). It would be more advanced the FRC, and it will also help college students in engineering classes. It would have a different game then FRC, where you would have to do a harder task. Any suggestions or comments?

[Zebra_Fact_Man]

This kinda sits outside of the purpose of FIRST. FRC, FTC, and the FLL's exist to get kids excited about pursuing STEM careers. Once you're in college, you either are or you aren't. FIRST has either done its job or it can't do much more for you.

Besides, there are MANY nonFIRST things to get involved with in college to satisfy your robotics needs, like real-life research. No reason to make up more arbitrary work.

[Canon reeves]

Maybe if it were fairly different. As mentioned, once you're in college you're either STEM or not, but what you do need in college is experience before you go into the workforce. So if there were a way to increase the difficulty, size, maybe even nature of the game, maybe it would be worth while. But there are however plenty of opportunities such as BAJA racing, research projects, and internships to get the experience you need to go into the work force. I personally would love one, but that's because I love FRC, and I'm completely biased.

[wesbass23]

Originally Posted by Zebra_Fact_Man

No reason to make up more arbitrary work.

What about fun though?

[DampRobot]

Originally Posted by Zebra_Fact_Man

Besides, there are MANY nonFIRST things to get involved with in college to satisfy your robotics needs, like real-life research. No reason to make up more arbitrary work.

I hate to pull out the ol "you'll understand when you're older," but I really didn't understand the truth in this statement until I went to college. It's a big, big world out there, and FRC is really only a tiny piece of it. At first, I wondered how I could be intellectually stimulated without FRC, now, I wonder how I ever put up with the insane hours, stupid inter team conflicts, and all the hard work that never seemed to pay off. I'm glad that I had the opertunity to do FRC, but I'm also glad that I'm taking a break now. There are so many awesome things to do at school that FRC no longer feels like the best use of my short time in college.

Plus, there is a way to do FRC in college. It's called mentoring. And, if you find the right team, it can be exactly the right level of fun, commitment, and involvement to suit your needs.

[dtengineering]

I believe DARPA beat you to it. http://www.theroboticschallenge.org/

Or RoboCup http://www.robocup2014.org/

Or Microtransat http://www.microtransat.org/

Or even good old MATE.

Personally, I think FIRST has been wise to avoid diluting their brand with a college variant.

Consider, for instance... at Championships. Who would have the honour of playing the final match?

Jason

[JohnFogarty]

I've researched a lot of the competitions that are robotics specific. None have anywhere near the competition experience or iterative design opportunities that FIRST provides unless you can show me I'm wrong. I understand that FIRST's goal is to get us interested in/into STEM education, but once you get here it's a bit disappointing to say the least.

There isn't an opportunity for me to join a DRC team in South Carolina. RoboCup doesn't look interesting to me really. I like NASA's Centennial Challenge Return Rover competition a lot, but I haven't been able to find nearly as much funding for it as say I could with my FRC team. Never seen microtransat before. I seem to think there might be a College Level Vex competition but I don't know much about it and there aren't any College Level events anywhere near South Carolina.

I remember them also piloting some Aeriel drone college level FIRST competition. Wasn't too popular though from what I saw at champs one year.

[Lil' Lavery]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collegi..._Demonstration

[Briansmithtown]

For me, it's hard leaving the FIRST community as a student, especially since I have been doing this since I was in 7th grade (2009). You get a feeling that you kinda lost something that was big in your life, and you start becoming less involved because, obviously, it's for the kids. But it is hard watching it knowing you really can't be involved like you use to be.

[Citrus Dad]

Originally Posted by Briansmithtown

For me, it's hard leaving the FIRST community as a student, especially since I have been doing this since I was in 7th grade (2009). You get a feeling that you kinda lost something that was big in your life, and you start becoming less involved because, obviously, it's for the kids. But it is hard watching it knowing you really can't be involved like you use to be.

You don't need to leave the FIRST community--you can mentor in college. You can be just as involved, just with a different purpose. It's really quite satisfying. My son made the transition quite readily. He's mentoring now with his old team, but he'll mentor another team next year (I now open the bidding for a one of the San Jose teams for his services.... )

[techhelpbb]

Personally just prefer to extend FIRST into MakerSpaces.
As a friendly competition not armed robot combat.

Why limit it to colleges?

Besides MakerSpaces completely remove the limitations on what the community can do with the tools.
Build FIRST robots.
Build wall clocks.
What's the difference as long as you are learning something and being constructive?

Take for example: NextFAB
http://www.nextfab.com/about/history

"Dr. Malone aspires to reinvigorate American manufacturing by putting the latest computer-aided design and advanced manufacturing technologies in the hands of innovative individuals and organizations, with the training, support, and friendly expert consultants necessary to help turn ideas into products, and products into businesses."

Seems a compatible goal.
Learn how to build the robot.
Learn how to use the shop.
Learn much more than building a robot (sounds familiar).

Imagine the value of FIRST if you continued to have access to what you used to be build that robot?

[Briansmithtown]

We can call it FCC, but we have to make sure the type of language we use

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by JohnFogarty

None have anywhere near the competition experience or iterative design opportunities that FIRST provides unless you can show me I'm wrong.

http://www.robotevents.com/robot-com...e-competition/

[JohnFogarty]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

http://www.robotevents.com/robot-com...e-competition/

I edited the above post after I thought a little more.

Originally Posted by JohnFogarty

I seem to think there might be a College Level Vex competition but I don't know much about it and there aren't any College Level events anywhere near South Carolina.

I remember them also piloting some Aeriel drone college level FIRST competition. Wasn't too popular though from what I saw at champs one year.

[Kevin Leonard]

One of the things that I don't like about college-level engineering competitions is that many of them have the same task each year.

Take Formula SAE Racing-
The challenge every year is to build a fast vehicle that wins races.

It doesn't have the variety of games that FIRST offers. It doesn't have the in-depth game strategy or defense that FIRST offers. (Or at least it doesn't seem to. I've never been a big fan of sports or competitions that don't allow for weaker athletes/competitors to win by playing intelligently- but that's a different discussion.)

Many of these competitions are about making incremental improvements on previous designs- many of which are important engineering challenges, and I'm not trying to knock those who do these competitions whatsoever- I just don't find much enjoyment in them personally.

I would love a collegiate version of FIRST personally. I would love a collegiate robotics competition with an open ended game to study and design new solutions for- not a robotics skills challenge.

However, I also think the lack of a collegiate FIRST competition can be good for FRC teams- college student mentors can be a huge help.