Go to Post It's a FIRST thing. You gots to understand. - Koko Ed [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Other > Math and Science
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 18:31
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 7,994
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
bending a new hook on a spring


Hey Chief Delphi, need your opinion.

I've got a tension spring with a worn hook. I was thinking of cutting the hook off at the long end (no problem) and bending a new one (??).

Do ya think the steel will bend OK, or break?


Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	spring.jpg
Views:	100
Size:	23.3 KB
ID:	19145  
Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 20:19
EricH's Avatar
EricH EricH is offline
New year, new team
FRC #1197 (Torbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 19,661
EricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post

Hey Chief Delphi, need your opinion.

I've got a tension spring with a worn hook. I was thinking of cutting the hook off at the long end (no problem) and bending a new one (??).

Do ya think the steel will bend OK, or break?
Neither. It's spring steel, so it'll spring back.

Kidding aside, it depends largely on how you bend it. If you were to bend it without heating, I'd put the odds of reduced life pretty high--but it's not as likely to break as you might think. But that bend isn't going to be easy without heat. Heating... well, I think you're as well aware as I am that heating isn't going to leave the desirable properties of the material alone.

And then you have the additional headache: is the reduced length going to cause extra tension in the system that the spring goes into?
__________________
Past teams:
2003-2007: FRC0330 BeachBots
2008: FRC1135 Shmoebotics
2012: FRC4046 Schroedinger's Dragons

"Rockets are tricky..."--Elon Musk

Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 20:20
gblake's Avatar
gblake gblake is online now
6th Gear Developer; Mentor
AKA: Blake Ross
no team (6th Gear)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: May 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,932
gblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond reputegblake has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post

Hey Chief Delphi, need your opinion.

I've got a tension spring with a worn hook. I was thinking of cutting the hook off at the long end (no problem) and bending a new one (??).

Do ya think the steel will bend OK, or break?


When I have tried in the past, my results were generally poor.
__________________
Blake Ross, For emailing me, in the verizon.net domain, I am blake
VRC Team Mentor, FTC volunteer, 5th Gear Developer, Husband, Father, Triangle Fraternity Alumnus (ky 76), U Ky BSEE, Tau Beta Pi, Eta Kappa Nu, Kentucky Colonel
Words/phrases I avoid: basis, mitigate, leveraging, transitioning, impact (instead of affect/effect), facilitate, programmatic, problematic, issue (instead of problem), latency (instead of delay), dependency (instead of prerequisite), connectivity, usage & utilize (instead of use), downed, functionality, functional, power on, descore, alumni (instead of alumnus/alumna), the enterprise, methodology, nomenclature, form factor (instead of size or shape), competency, modality, provided(with), provision(ing), irregardless/irrespective, signage, colorized, pulsating, ideate
Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 20:23
Mr V's Avatar
Mr V Mr V is offline
FIRST Senior Mentor Washington
FRC #5588 (Reign)
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Maple Valley Wa
Posts: 989
Mr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond reputeMr V has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

You'll want to heat the end cherry red before forming it into the new hook. On the other hand a good independent hardware store will have a selection of a couple of hundred springs, one of which should do the trick for a dollar or so.
__________________
All statements made on Chief Delphi by me are my own opinions and are not official FIRST rulings or opinions and should not be construed as such.




https://www.facebook.com/pages/Team-...77508782410839
Reply With Quote
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 20:24
Richard Wallace's Avatar
Richard Wallace Richard Wallace is offline
I live for the details.
FRC #3620 (Average Joes)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Southwestern Michigan
Posts: 3,620
Richard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post

Hey Chief Delphi, need your opinion.

I've got a tension spring with a worn hook. I was thinking of cutting the hook off at the long end (no problem) and bending a new one (??).


Remember Hooke's Law, especially regarding the length of wire you use to form the hook.
__________________
Richard Wallace

Mentor since 2011 for FRC 3620 Average Joes (St. Joseph, Michigan)
Mentor 2002-10 for FRC 931 Perpetual Chaos (St. Louis, Missouri)
since 2003

I believe in intuition and inspiration. Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited, whereas imagination embraces the entire world, stimulating progress, giving birth to evolution. It is, strictly speaking, a real factor in scientific research.
(Cosmic Religion : With Other Opinions and Aphorisms (1931) by Albert Einstein, p. 97)
Reply With Quote
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 20:42
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 7,994
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
Remember Hooke's Law, especially regarding the length of wire you use to form the hook.
Yeah, I'll add an S hook to make the tension correct.

The spring is from my 18-year-old Whirlpool washing machine. So I guess it has a good 20 years left on it right?


Reply With Quote
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 21:00
Richard Wallace's Avatar
Richard Wallace Richard Wallace is offline
I live for the details.
FRC #3620 (Average Joes)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Southwestern Michigan
Posts: 3,620
Richard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Yeah, I'll add an S hook to make the tension correct.

The spring is from my 18-year-old Whirlpool washing machine. So I guess it has a good 20 years left on it right?


I thought that spring looked familiar. Maybe I can dig one up around here somewhere.
__________________
Richard Wallace

Mentor since 2011 for FRC 3620 Average Joes (St. Joseph, Michigan)
Mentor 2002-10 for FRC 931 Perpetual Chaos (St. Louis, Missouri)
since 2003

I believe in intuition and inspiration. Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited, whereas imagination embraces the entire world, stimulating progress, giving birth to evolution. It is, strictly speaking, a real factor in scientific research.
(Cosmic Religion : With Other Opinions and Aphorisms (1931) by Albert Einstein, p. 97)
Reply With Quote
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 16-06-2015, 21:01
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 7,994
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
I thought that spring looked familiar. Maybe I can dig one up around here somewhere.
You are a saint. Washer model LSC8244EQ.


Reply With Quote
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 17-06-2015, 03:50
msaunders msaunders is offline
Registered User
AKA: Mike Saunders
FRC #0862 (Lightning Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 21
msaunders is just really nicemsaunders is just really nicemsaunders is just really nicemsaunders is just really nicemsaunders is just really nice
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Perhaps this is the one, if Richard cannot supply one.

http://www.repairclinic.com/PartDeta...d111988&mr= 1

Fortunately I only live a couple miles away from their location so I do not have to pay shipping when I need parts.
__________________
-= 862 =- Lightning Robotics, Canton, MI
2015 FiM Bedford District Chairman's Award
2014 FiM Bedford District Winner
2013 12th seed, Curie Division Winner with 1678 and 148
2013 Michigan State Championship Entrepreneurship Award
2013 FiM West Michigan District Winner, Engineering Inspiration Award
2013 FiM Kettering District Winner, Engineering Inspiration Award

Last edited by msaunders : 17-06-2015 at 12:03.
Reply With Quote
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 17-06-2015, 10:59
FrankJ's Avatar
FrankJ FrankJ is online now
Robot Mentor
FRC #2974 (WALT)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Marietta GA
Posts: 1,880
FrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond reputeFrankJ has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

The trick will be bending it. The straight portion has not been plastically deformed so it should have all of its ductility left. Putting the same radius bend as the original hook shouldn't break it.
__________________
If you don't know what you should hook up then you should read a data sheet
Reply With Quote
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-06-2015, 12:16
Richard Wallace's Avatar
Richard Wallace Richard Wallace is offline
I live for the details.
FRC #3620 (Average Joes)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Southwestern Michigan
Posts: 3,620
Richard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

After some searching I have found two springs. One is stronger than the other (thicker wire). See attached. Is one of them a match for yours?
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Two Springs.pdf (174.4 KB, 20 views)
__________________
Richard Wallace

Mentor since 2011 for FRC 3620 Average Joes (St. Joseph, Michigan)
Mentor 2002-10 for FRC 931 Perpetual Chaos (St. Louis, Missouri)
since 2003

I believe in intuition and inspiration. Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited, whereas imagination embraces the entire world, stimulating progress, giving birth to evolution. It is, strictly speaking, a real factor in scientific research.
(Cosmic Religion : With Other Opinions and Aphorisms (1931) by Albert Einstein, p. 97)
Reply With Quote
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-06-2015, 12:48
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 7,994
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
After some searching I have found two springs. One is stronger than the other (thicker wire). See attached. Is one of them a match for yours?
I had to put the machine back in service temporarily for the weekend laundry.

I'll open it up early next week and put the calipers on the wire.

Thanks.



Reply With Quote
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-06-2015, 18:51
Michael Hill's Avatar
Michael Hill Michael Hill is offline
Registered User
FRC #3138 (Innovators Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 1,562
Michael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
After some searching I have found two springs. One is stronger than the other (thicker wire). See attached. Is one of them a match for yours?
I don't mean to be daft, but how does a single model of washer get associated with two nearly identical springs where the only difference is 0.2mm in diameter? Is it the same part, just for a later model after fixing something? Are parts in washing machines so fickle they can't be interchanged with each other?
Reply With Quote
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-06-2015, 19:20
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 7,994
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hill View Post
I don't mean to be daft, but how does a single model of washer get associated with two nearly identical springs where the only difference is 0.2mm in diameter?
That's not the way I interpreted it.

The two springs Richard found are unmarked and he wants to know which is the correct one for my washer.

I assumed the other spring is for a washer with a lighter (smaller) or heavier (larger) tub.



Reply With Quote
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-06-2015, 20:25
Michael Hill's Avatar
Michael Hill Michael Hill is offline
Registered User
FRC #3138 (Innovators Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 1,562
Michael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond reputeMichael Hill has a reputation beyond repute
Re: bending a new hook on a spring

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
That's not the way I interpreted it.

The two springs Richard found are unmarked and he wants to know which is the correct one for my washer.

I assumed the other spring is for a washer with a lighter (smaller) or heavier (larger) tub.



Gotcha. I assumed he looked it up in some database and both were returned as possible.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:35.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi