Interesting/Cool Scaling Mechanism Designs

[GeeTwo]

Originally Posted by martin417

For the purpose of FRC, a compressor is a positive displacement device.

What about:

Originally Posted by martin417

don't try to create rules that don't exist

FRC doesn't define a compressor but they do say that there shall be only one source of compressed air, and that it must be rated 1.10cfm or less. I don't remember anything about a positive displacement device in the rules...

[martin417]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

What about:



FRC doesn't define a compressor but they do say that there shall be only one source of compressed air, and that it must be rated 1.10cfm or less. I don't remember anything about a positive displacement device in the rules...

Note: the below is my opinion. I am not on the GDC. For a definitive ruling, submit a question to the GDC.

A fan does not provide compressed air, it provides flow. That is why it is very difficult to even find a rating for delta P for most muffin fans as supplied in the KOP in the past. But I was able to find a rating for for a special "high static pressure" muffin fan for restrictive computer cases. This "high static pressure" fan was able to create a static delta P of .002 PSI when dead-headed.

Fans are listed in the rules under the electrical rules, not the pneumatic rules, for the excellent reason that they are not pneumatic devices.

The Q&A cited earlier was a question about using air from a solenoid valve attached to the pneumatic system, not a fan.

If you are not a member of the GDC, do not cite your opinion as fact (note that I have taken my own advice).

[GeeTwo]

Until and unless the GDC clarifies otherwise, I'll continue to assume that the manuals are written in American English.

[martin417]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Until and unless the GDC clarifies otherwise, I'll continue to assume that the manuals are written in American English.

Can't really argue with that. Of course it really has no bearing on the productive discussion at hand. My admonishment stands: If you are not on the GDC, please do not state your opinion as fact.

Are my bumpers compressors? When my robot is in motion, there is a rise in static pressure across the surface. What about closed cell foam (like pool noodles are made of)? when force is applied to the foam, the pressure inside the cells of the foam is increased. Every time two robots collide or push against each other they are creating air pressure inside the closed cell foam far in excess of anything that could be produced by a muffin fan.

The pneumatic system rules are very clear. Fans are not mentioned, in English or any other language.

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Until and unless the GDC clarifies otherwise, I'll continue to assume that the manuals are written in American English.

What are you even talking about? Like, honestly, this post makes absolutely no sense. No one said anything about what language to read the manual in, or the definitions of words.

The Manual allows fans, both electronics muffin fans and fans powered by FRC motors. A cloth bag placed over a fan is not containing compressed air - it's just containing air. The bag restricts flow of the air somewhat but it is not airtight - the bag does not stay even close to inflated the second the air is cut.

These rules have been the same for years, and in previous years the GDC has explicitly allowed mechanisms just like these. There's substantial historical precedent for these mechanisms (see blockers in 2013, similar hanging mechanisms in 2010, etc). You can't state your opinion as certain fact and then refuse to listen to anyone else's view unless the GDC says so. You're applying different levels of scrutiny to yourself versus others.

[bkahl]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

Until and unless the GDC clarifies otherwise, I'll continue to assume that the manuals are written in American English.

Do the Canadians get this in Canadian English?

What about those Aussies?

And we can't forget the Hawaiians!

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously Gus, your logic just isn't there.
From my understanding...
If my dump valve happens to dump air into a Versatube somewhere on my robot because its mounted near that, I guess that's part of the pnuematics system now?

Introducing the new VEX Versatube with new PNEUMATIC Features!

What about the 2013 blocker I remember 116 having at IRI?

[lovelj]

Originally Posted by martin417

Note: the below is my opinion. I am not on the GDC. For a definitive ruling, submit a question to the GDC.

A fan does not provide compressed air, it provides flow. That is why it is very difficult to even find a rating for delta P for most muffin fans as supplied in the KOP in the past. But I was able to find a rating for for a special "high static pressure" muffin fan for restrictive computer cases. This "high static pressure" fan was able to create a static delta P of .002 PSI when dead-headed.

Fans are listed in the rules under the electrical rules, not the pneumatic rules, for the excellent reason that they are not pneumatic devices.

The Q&A cited earlier was a question about using air from a solenoid valve attached to the pneumatic system, not a fan.

If you are not a member of the GDC, do not cite your opinion as fact (note that I have taken my own advice).

Here is what OSHA says... Compressed gas is anything over 40 psi. I seriously doubt if they got over 10 psi.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAZMAT_Class_2_Gases

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by lovelj

Here is what OSHA says... Compressed gas is anything over 40 psi. I seriously doubt if they got over 10 psi.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAZMAT_Class_2_Gases

I seriously doubt they got over .1 psi.

[bennettj800]

I apologize for stating my opinion as fact... I never intended to do so, nor to cause any uproars... I am a friend of logic, and when I state my opinion it often transgresses into a logical statement (in my mind) and therefore comes into existence as written fact, be it direct or determined. i hope i didn't rustle too many feathers

[BAB the Builder]

Originally Posted by GeeTwo

We had an idea like that but decided that it would have failed inspection under R77 and as clarified by Q688.





I don't know how 4060 did this, but we were considering a coiled wire or tube inside the inflatable that kept things from getting too far out of hand. Our first iteration would have been with a piece of lightweight dryer vent tube.

We had prototyped one of these a while ago and it worked really wel, just not enough space in the bot. to get around the rules of inflating it ours did not get hooked into the pneumatic system, but instead a bag motor on a leaf blower impeller. worked great.

[Ken5736]

Our scaling mechanism proved to be effective.
One or two issues with hook delivery. Our hook got bounced out of holder due to bouncing around by we solved that

https://vimeo.com/161551049

We used two 200 lb gas springs with 16" stroke ganged together to pull 32" of cable
Once hook was positioned it never failed.

[Liu346]

Originally Posted by Ken5736

Our scaling mechanism proved to be effective.
One or two issues with hook delivery. Our hook got bounced out of holder due to bouncing around by we solved that

https://vimeo.com/161551049

We used two 200 lb gas springs with 16" stroke ganged together to pull 32" of cable
Once hook was positioned it never failed.

Wow that looked super fast. What made yall go with this decision verses a winch.

[cad321]

Originally Posted by Liu346

Wow that looked super fast. What made yall go with this decision verses a winch.

2386 nearly went with using gas shocks too. They have the advantage of still pulling the robot up even once the buzzer goes. Effectively giving you another 5 seconds to the match.

[mman1506]

Originally Posted by cad321

2386 nearly went with using gas shocks too. They have the advantage of still pulling the robot up even once the buzzer goes. Effectively giving you another 5 seconds to the match.

3.1.4

"A ROBOT has SCALED the TOWER if, at the conclusion of the MATCH, the ROBOT:
A. is in contact with a unique RUNG, and
B. has all of its BUMPERS fully above the height of the low GOALS."

[Peyton Yeung]

Originally Posted by mman1506

3.1.4

3.3.1

The final assessment of ROBOTS having SCALED or CHALLENGED the TOWER is made five (5) seconds
after the ARENA timer displays zero (0), or when all ROBOTS have come to rest following the conclusion
of the MATCH, whichever happens first.