2017 New York Regionals

[Brian Maher]

With all the chatter on other threads about the New York Regionals, I figured it could use its own thread. Here is the lineup:

• Week 3: Finger Lakes Regional
• Week 3: Tech Valley Regional
• Week 4: Hudson Valley Regional
• Week 5: Long Island Regional
• Week 6: New York City Regional

Next year will be interesting for New York, to say the least. I am really excited to see a new regional. This is one solid step in the move to the district model and will hopefully make it easier for downstate teams to get second plays.

[Sperkowsky]

Originally Posted by BMSOTM

This is one solid step in the move to the district model and will hopefully make it easier for downstate teams to get second plays.

If anything being nyc is smaller now, hvr is fairly small and the 2 upstate regionals are the same week; second plays for lower state teams are going to be harder. Not much but definitely not a step in the right direction In terms of easier second plays. All in all though I am happier with smaller regionals.

[Bluman56]

I counted 48 teams in the 5 boroughs of NYC alone. 24 initial spots for NYC regional is insanity to the highest degree. I highly doubt that 24 will turn into 48 or more spots after all is said and done. This season will be a nightmare for underfunded NYC teams (aka the VAST majority of them). I would not be surprised to see the team I've been helping since last year having to skip this season completely because of this mess. Obviously for the sake of the kids I hope not, but the chances of us getting into NYC regional with all the competition from upstate teams and out of state teams that always make their way to NYC make the outlook extremely bleak.

A real shame what this has turned into.

[ollien]

Originally Posted by Bluman56

I counted 48 teams in the 5 boroughs of NYC alone. 24 initial spots for NYC regional is insanity to the highest degree. I highly doubt that 24 will turn into 48 or more spots after all is said and done.

If the initial 38 before the 24 arrived is any indication, I think it could go as high as 45, but take my thoughts with a grain of salt.

[Kevin Leonard]

I hope that this is just a temporary awkward teenage step toward districts that pays off in the long run. The introduction of HVR should help unite upstate and downstate teams while making it more convenient for a few teams to get second plays in.

That being said- if the NYC and HVR Regional committees fail to prioritize low resource teams off the waitlist, this could turn out to be a real disaster. I have confidence that the regionals will work themselves out- the NYCFIRST team is pretty phenomenal at what they do.

And hopefully in future years, the upstate regionals will better organize themselves, or perhaps give us another option to attend- perhaps a Syracuse Regional?

For now, I hope Downstate/Ohio/Montreal is ready for stray NY teams to appear, because Upstate really has nowhere else to go right now.

[Chris is me]

One data point I'm interested in looking at is comparing the total number of available spots, and estimated capacities, of the 2017 regionals as a whole compared to their 2016 counterparts. How many spots are we gaining this year? Should teams in one region or another expect to need to travel out of state?

[bdaroz]

• Finger Lakes - 2017: 40* 2016: 50**
• Tech Valley - 2017: 26* 2016: 36
• Hudson Valley - 2017: 24* 2016: (New in '17)
• SBPLI - 2017: 31* 2016: 51
• NYC - 2017: 24* 2016: 66

2017* capacity: 145
2016 capacity: 203

* - Prelim availability, will be expended.. to what?
** - 49 teams attended in '16, but still had 1 team open

If we make some reasonable assumptions... FLR TVR SBPLI all being in the same location will have the same capacity. We get to 185... Assume at no event will be less than 36 teams, we get to 209....

The wrench thrown in is NYC being in a different location, and no idea what the final capacity will be.

[Conor Ryan]

Originally Posted by bdaroz

• Finger Lakes - 2017: 40* 2016: 50**
• Tech Valley - 2017: 26* 2016: 36
• Hudson Valley - 2017: 24* 2016: (New in '17)
• SBPLI - 2017: 31* 2016: 51
• NYC - 2017: 24* 2016: 66

2017* capacity: 145
2016 capacity: 203

* - Prelim availability, will be expended.. to what?
** - 49 teams attended in '16, but still had 1 team open

If we make some reasonable assumptions... FLR TVR SBPLI all being in the same location will have the same capacity. We get to 185... Assume at no event will be less than 36 teams, we get to 209....

The wrench thrown in is NYC being in a different location, and no idea what the final capacity will be.

I'm going to put money that we can expect about a max of 48 teams in HVR.
The real question is which event does an NYC team sign up for first? I still think a vast majority of teams will get locked out of multiple events.

[bdaroz]

Originally Posted by Conor Ryan

I'm going to put money that we can expect about a max of 48 teams in HVR.
The real question is which event does an NYC team sign up for first? I still think a vast majority of teams will get locked out of multiple events.

Given that the decision is all but made for us - 1 regional this year.... if I were an upstate team looking for 2 I'd put down our first request for HVR and 2nd request for TVR/FLR, as it looks to me like the pressure will be to get into HVR, both for upstate teams, and NYC teams.

Now, if the Montreal regional committee made a push to attract some of us upstate teams, maybe by putting together a packet to help understand the logistics of the border crossing with a bunch of kids/parts and what we can/can't bring, and how to do so... Montreal might become an easier option for some teams. Just a thought.

[rpaulsen]

Looking at the map, it seems that if NY can get an event going at least at in Suffolk, and maybe at Syracuse, it would be very easy to switch over to a district. One of the biggest concerns about switching to District was how that would affect the NYC Regional event. With the change in venue to the Armory, that isn't really an issue any more. I think it is important that teams to be able to attend two events without having to stay overnight, and feel that it would be far easier to raise the money to raise the extra money to go to a centrally located "State Championship" that would require an overnight.

[Bluman56]

Originally Posted by Kevin Leonard

I hope that this is just a temporary awkward teenage step toward districts that pays off in the long run. The introduction of HVR should help unite upstate and downstate teams while making it more convenient for a few teams to get second plays in.

That being said- if the NYC and HVR Regional committees fail to prioritize low resource teams off the waitlist, this could turn out to be a real disaster. I have confidence that the regionals will work themselves out- the NYCFIRST team is pretty phenomenal at what they do.

And hopefully in future years, the upstate regionals will better organize themselves, or perhaps give us another option to attend- perhaps a Syracuse Regional?

For now, I hope Downstate/Ohio/Montreal is ready for stray NY teams to appear, because Upstate really has nowhere else to go right now.

Only problem is that the MAJORITY (I'd say close to 80%) of NYC teams are critically underfunded with many depending on NYCFirst being able to pay for their registration. So in essence, the committee has to figure out how to balance 48 strictly NYC teams with upstate and out of state teams. Once they start excluding NYC teams, those teams are done for the season, no competition, no robot. They can't go to LI because they either have not enough money for Registration or the commute is too expensive (NYC schools are extremely strict with how long and how far students can go on trips during school days). Forget HVR for the majority of NYC teams because that's both too far and requires lodging.

Sure I agree NYCFirst does magnificent work, but there are teams in NYC that are so critically underfunded that they need to ask the genie for more than 3 wishes, and this time around the genie (NYCFirst) might not be able to accommodate. Seems only time will tell at this point.

[rpaulsen]

Originally Posted by Bluman56

Forget HVR for the majority of NYC teams because that's both too far and requires lodging.

Sure I agree NYCFirst does magnificent work, but there are teams in NYC that are so critically underfunded that they need to ask the genie for more than 3 wishes, and this time around the genie (NYCFirst) might not be able to accommodate. Seems only time will tell at this point.

Suffern is a lot closer than you may think, especially for teams from Uptown or the Bronx. There are two ways to get there, either by crossing the GWB or Tappen Zee, and each way it is only about 45 minutes of travel in each direction. Last year I brought my team down from New Rochelle to Long Island, an identical distance to Suffern, and we took the bus back and forth each day. Sure it was a little tiring, but it was fine. We skipped load in on Wednesday night, only brought our pit crew on Thursday, and bused the Friday/Saturday.

I expect that we will start seeing a bit of a split in the NYC area teams, where uptown/Bronx teams start favoring HVRA and downtown/Brooklyn/Queens/SI favoring Long Island. Realistically, we probably would need at least one more area event in either Suffolk or Brooklyn to make this area work best in a District model.

[Bluman56]

Originally Posted by rpaulsen

Suffern is a lot closer than you may think, especially for teams from Uptown or the Bronx. There are two ways to get there, either by crossing the GWB or Tappen Zee, and each way it is only about 45 minutes of travel in each direction. Last year I brought my team down from New Rochelle to Long Island, an identical distance to Suffern, and we took the bus back and forth each day. Sure it was a little tiring, but it was fine. We skipped load in on Wednesday night, only brought our pit crew on Thursday, and bused the Friday/Saturday.

I expect that we will start seeing a bit of a split in the NYC area teams, where uptown/Bronx teams start favoring HVRA and downtown/Brooklyn/Queens/SI favoring Long Island. Realistically, we probably would need at least one more area event in either Suffolk or Brooklyn to make this area work best in a District model.

With all due respect, look at the attendance rate of the HudsonValleyRally offseason event. Not every team has access to a parent with a car or a mentor with a car (for example our team has access to a car through our Lead Mentor who is a dean of the school and through a fellow mentor, both of which work in jobs that require them to be on call at all times. I imagine given the attendance rates of this event and the event in 2010, other teams share the same struggles. To be clear, if an event cannot be accessed by public transportation (MTA trains to Javits for example), many NYC teams would not attend.

I've been on the most well funded team in NYC before joining the team I'm helping now and the dynamic is strikingly different. Everything that seems like a nonissue to a medium-well funded team is a huge issue for low resource teams.

I completely agree that we need more events in the 5 boroughs. HVR is the right step towards districts, but inner city teams are being completely ignored at this point.

[ollien]

Originally Posted by Bluman56

With all due respect, look at the attendance rate of the HudsonValleyRally offseason event

Just wanna point out that the original date overlapped with the SAT, which I would chalk up to be part of the reason so few teams attended.

[plnyyanks]

Originally Posted by Bluman56

I completely agree that we need more events in the 5 boroughs. HVR is the right step towards districts, but inner city teams are being completely ignored at this point.

Definitely agree on this point. Here's my back of napkin math (as best I remember it, using last season's numbers): New York state has about 130 teams, split roughly evenly between NYC+Westchester, LI, and the rest of the state (about 45 teams in each area).

That means, for proper execution of the district system, NYC teams would require 90 plays, which 3x36 team events. Same for the LI and "upstate" regions. NYC+Westchester has two district-sized events this year, and LI has a regional approximately the size of two district events.

Now this year, there are only 122 spots for ~90 teams across NYC+LI (assuming NYC and HVR hold 36 teams and LI holds 50). That's cutting it awful close (not even including second plays and the rest of the state)...