Question to all teams...

[dlavery]

Originally posted by Ken L
This can be done by having Dean, Woodie, Dave, and others make up their mind a little earlier.

HAH HAH HAH HAH! OOOOOHHH!!! That's rich! NNNGGGGHHH! YEAH - RIGHT! -GGG-SNORT- Har Har Har!

(great crashing sound as Dave falls over on the floor, clutching his sides in a laughing paralysis...)

[Ken Leung]

Thought you would like that... Just a suggest anyway... Maybe you guys will actually listen to it sometime

[HolyMasamune]

Since teams in other countries already know the main objective of the game and how it's played, they can use the fact that they don't have the kit as an advantage. They'll be forced to have more organized brainstorming sessions with a lot of prototyping, so when they do get the kit, they'll make it really well. Some teams just dive into the kit and start trying to make a robot, which doesn't work very well especially if they skip the detailed brainstorming and/or drawing/prototyping stage.

[Katie Reynolds]

Dave, Bill and Ken said everything I was thinking!

Teams from anywhere and everywhere have the opportunity to attand a kick off and pick up their kits then. If not, they are going to have to wait for the kits to be shipped. If they 100 or 1,000 miles away, it shouldn't matter.

Having remote kick-offs for international teams might not be a bad idea. The only problem is that there are so few teams right now, it would be hard to hold something like that. Maybe have a remote kick-off in Brazil, Canada and somewhere in Europe. But like Ken said, more teams means a better chance for a remote kick off!

To answer the main question, I don't think any team should have more or less build time than another. But then again, you can never make anything 100% "fair".

- Katie

[Ed Crammond]

True, FIRST will never be completely fair, thats just some of the things we have to live with. However i think compromises can be made to even things up in regards to overseas teams.

Pre-shipping of the parts to at least the country (or hawaii!) that they are intended for sounds like a good idea. However i have a suspicion that kits may be changed at the last minute so things could be left in or out of preshipped kits. Someone may correct me on this one.

I accept that teams shouldnt really be building in the first two weeks anyway however there were some quite critical things that needed to be looked at from the kits, when designing.

First and most obviously are the bins, we dont have them here and there were no detailled documentation regarding them that we could find. At present, two weeks after kickoff, the two prvided with the kit have still not arrived. If we had no contacts like Nick in the US or the generosity of Jaqui and 388, we really would be in trouble.

Other items need to be ordered from the US during the build period, like pnuematic cylinders. Last year they took 3 weeks to arrive, so after ordering them in the middle of the 2nd, they arrived with just over a week to spare. Had there been any trouble with shipping (like our 2002 robot taking 3 months to arrive back from the NYC regional), again we would have been in trouble.
One way around this is to permit alternative suppliers of parts and although i confess i havent examined the suppling rules in great detail this year, i applaud the efforts of FIRST to "open up" the supplying market. (Can we have RS and Maplin on the suppliers list next year please!).

Although things are never going to be perfect, if there was some specific provision to encourage overseas teams it would increase the appeal for people to start new teams overseas. These provisions need not give these teams an advantage, but some recognition of difficulties would be appreciated!

[Useless member]

Corect me if im wrong but I recall at one time there being only one kick off in the whole country.
Many teams had a very hard time getting there from all over the world and pick up their kits and listen to the new game, especialy in the winter with a full blown blizzard and ice storm goin on.
I recall many teams "Wishing" for remote locations because of the travel dificulty and the expense of getting to NH.
This whole concept was change for the good of all and sure things are a lot easier for "MOST" Teams but not all.
Let me ask this.... Is there any one on FIRST that could have guessed what this years game was by just looking at the KIT!!!. I dont think so.
To send the kit in advance of the game to some team would not compromise the integrity of the game plan. Besides we do have "GP" and if the containers are sealed and not to be opened untill the "KO" then I believe all teams will honor that system.
Just my .02c

[whiskas]

Yes. We do face extra trouble. Can you say "Educational Robotics Competition" to a Customs officer which is used to dealing with dozens of electronic parts smugglers everyday?
I find all those "barriers" and the short timeframe great. Our students ( and I once was a student in #383, the other brazilian team ) have to learn about foreign trade stuff; international shipping rules and requirements; and all the assorted measurements, currency, etc. I don't want it to get any easy. It would take so much of the fun away.